Fear of the Future and Financial Pressure (Stress Management for Overwhelmed HSPs)

Todd: [00:00:00] If you’re interested in the work of Byron Katie, and you’ve been listening to some of these episodes, you’ve been hearing people do the work and you want to go in a little deeper, then I highly recommend the work 1 0 1. This is an online course that I’ve created and I’ve been offering for, I. A long time, now, many years, and it continues to improve.

And this is a a chance for you to actually do the work and work with somebody, a trainer, and go deep into the practice and learn the nuances of this meditation practice. So if you’re interested, go to the work as meditation.com and click on the work 1 0 1.

Client: In the voice, in my head, I keep going through, okay, I have this much, it costs that much. I have this, I have this much, it costs that much. So I think the worry is that it’s gonna end up costing more than I have, or, you know, or something like that. I’m, I’m not [00:01:00] sure where to go with this. With a statement, 

Todd: welcome to Wiggle Room, a podcast where we start with stress and look for ways to turn it around.

And we use something called the work of Byron Katie. This is a way of questioning the stressful thoughts that you may have in any particular situation. And when you question your thoughts, you start to open to new possibilities. I’m Todd Smith and on the program today. Someone asks a question about doing the work in your head and sometimes losing enthusiasm, uh, for the work when doing it that way.

And then someone does the work on the stressful thought, I’m never going to be able to retire. And then I’ll also read my newsletter article. Have you questioned your financial dreams? So the theme seems to be a little bit about [00:02:00] finances in this episode, and I hope you will enjoy it. Um, there’s a lot of material and it’s all based on the work of Byron Katie, which is this simple way of questioning what you think.

As always, I’ll be sharing first the recording from my open sessions, and that is an unedited recording. Um, so that you can experience exactly how. The work is done in real life. So here’s a recording from this week’s open session.

Client 2: I’ll start with a question. 

Todd: Yeah, sure. 

Client 2: Yeah. So I think I’ve asked it before, but, so when my mind is really twirling around and I’ll catch a thought and I’ll say, is that true? And usually, uh, it’s, no, I’m, you know, I’m pretty good at fair at that. But then right after I go, no, then the next negative thought will come up.

Client: Mm-hmm. 

Client 2: And I’ll say, is that true? [00:03:00] No, I don’t have to go any farther. But now sometimes they’ll just keep going as you know, like endlessly. And then at some point I’ll go, well, is that true? Is that true? Then I start losing my enthusiasm for asking the question and getting that nice no. And then after i’s like, oh, just forget it now.

Mm-hmm. Would Byron case here, what you would say, would say when you even go, okay, I, I’m tired of say, would you then ask, is that true or is there another thing that you could do to like sort of rest and reset before you go back to, is it true. 

Todd: Right. Yeah. Because it becomes almost cliche after a while, right?

Oh, is it true? Is it true? Like it is, like you just keep repeating it after a while. You’re not even thinking of the meaning of it anymore. It just becomes, um, yeah. Meaningless. Uh, yeah. So the trick is to slow it down really. And maybe one way is, like you said, [00:04:00] taking a break and coming back to it. Um. The other way is to just slow it down further.

Like the mind is hard to slow down when you’re just doing the work in your mind, but when you bring it onto paper or bring it onto a, like a something on your computer where you’re typing out the work, or if you’re speaking it with a partner, then it slows down a little further, and so then. Um, you know, you go from, is it true to, can you absolutely know it’s true?

And then, then how do I react? And who would you be without the thought and go through the turnarounds? And that whole, that whole battery of questions just keeps slowing. Thi slowing things down, slowing things down, slowing things down, and it just drops you in closer and closer to, oh wow, I don’t know what’s going on.

And you really. Are in it, uh, as opposed to just kind of spinning your wheels doing the work. Um, so that would be my, you know, that’s my suggestion. That’s what works for me, is if I can’t slow the mind [00:05:00] down on its own, just doing the work mentally, then I, I take it to paper, I do the formal inquiry, and it can only take like, you know, 5, 10, 20 minutes of writing it out in a notebook and, and there it is.

Suddenly I’m seeing all kinds of. Interesting nuances and that keeps the mind interested. So, yeah,

you know, sometimes when I’m just out and about and I’m not doing the work, uh, or I’m not formally doing the work, I also really love question four. Like, who would, who would I be without this thought? Right? Right In that moment, you know, when I’m thinking, oh yeah, this is. Not the way it should be. And then it’s like, who would I be without that thought right then?

And it kind of, it’s a creative kind of thinking, who would I be? And that sometimes slows me down. But nothing substitutes for doing the work on paper, you know? Or with a partner 

Client: like that.[00:06:00] 

So any other questions or anyone wanna 

Todd: jump in and do the work? Yeah, Wendy. 

Client: Yeah. So, um, kind of to go with what I was talking about before, um, like it seems like I, you know, I have this little fear that, that I’m. I’m gonna run outta money before I have finished fixing this house up for my retirement.

Mm-hmm. You know, because the things that I’m, we’re trying to do turn out to be more expensive than we’re expecting it to be. And so I’ve been still working and I still have some time before I’m gonna retire, but I’m like. I’m making myself tired, just looking at how much more needs to be done kind of thing.

Mm-hmm. Right, and, and I had the thought. I wonder if I’m kind of putting myself through an [00:07:00] unnecessary hell here.

Todd: I wonder, gee.

Yeah. Well, would you like to do the work on it? 

Client: I would and, and the, in the voice, in my head, I keep going through, okay, I have this much, it costs that much. I have this, I have this much, it costs that much. So I think the worry is that it’s gonna end up costing more than I have, or, you know, or something like that.

I’m, I’m not sure where to go with the, with the statement. 

Todd: Okay. Yeah, I’ve heard a couple different versions from you. One is I’m gonna run outta money before I finish, before I finish fixing the house up before I retire. And the other is, it’s gonna end up costing me, uh, more than I have. Yeah. So which one, which would result in me 

Client: having to work a lot more, 

Todd: right?

Client: Yeah. Right. 

Todd: They’re both pointing at the same exact, pretty much. Right. [00:08:00] So which one feels. 

Client: Well, that I’m gonna have to, because I wouldn’t run outta money. I would work more. Yeah. I see. So, yeah. So I’m just gonna have to work more than I want to in order to prepare the house for retirement. Yeah. Yeah. Okay.

Todd: Okay. So. So that’s kind of a third version is I’m gonna have to work more, um, to prepare the house for retirement. The other is I’m, it’s gonna end up costing more. Oh yeah. It’s gonna end uping more, which results in not 

Client: to work more. Yeah. So something costing more means working more to me. 

Todd: I hear you. Okay.

Okay. So then you’re gonna have to. Work. I’m 

Client: never gonna be able to retire. 

Todd: Yeah. That’s what it really comes down to. I’m never gonna be able to retire. Okay. There we that true?[00:09:00] 

Client: No. No, eventually I’m just going to,

Todd: so how do you react when you see all these costs, overruns and projections and, and you, you know, and you’re thinking you’re never gonna be able to retire because of this house

Client: in a couple different places? One of them, it goes to. So, you know, there’s like,

which, which could be another worksheet as well. I’m, I’m gonna be still working and I’ll end up so old. I have dementia and, you know, everything will, you know, I won’t be able to work. And [00:10:00] even though I still need the money, I won’t be able to retire. And, and I’ll work myself to, the pictures are working myself to death, you know?

Yeah. Or, um, working myself into an illness or having, having some unnecessary comfort become more important. You know, it’s like losing my sanity of what’s. Basically important, what I really need, it goes off in like 10 different directions at once. And that’s why it’s so hard to come up with a statement, right?

Because as soon as I think in terms of one thing, I see all these other possibilities. So, um, yeah, like I have to stay healthy. I have, I, there’s all these, um, when I think I’ll never be able to retire, it’s like, oh, no.[00:11:00] 

Yeah, I’ll end up working myself to death. 

Todd: Yeah. 

Client: Yeah.

Todd: So I’ll never be able to retire. Where do you feel that in your body? 

Client: My, my shoulders drop. I get, I get heavy, I get tired. I just wanna sit. You know, I have, I, I come home from work and all the way driving home. I’m thinking, oh, when I get home, I’ll get up, I’ll go for a walk, I’ll take the dog for a walk, I’ll do something.

You know, like, and then I walk in the house and I just come sit on the couch. 

Todd: Mm-hmm. Yeah. And how, what does your mind do with this whole project of renovating the house when you’re thinking? I may never be able to retire because the costs keep increasing,[00:12:00] 

Client: uh, a variety of pictures of

the, um, having to find a way to live in it.

You know, in whatever condition it’s in, which is weird because I’m, I’m the insanity of this whole question and where my mind goes, takes me into a past condition of the house, and I’ve already updated parts of the house. And in my mind when I picture that, I see it in its old condition before it’s even like, it doesn’t even look like that now.

That’s how insane the, the pictures get, right? Mm-hmm. Yeah. Mm-hmm. So it takes me into an, an another [00:13:00] world that’s not the current world.

Wow.

Into circumstances that can’t happen.

Amazing. Right.

Todd: Go on a little trip.

Client: Exactly. And, and then I totally forget that, you know, I have, I have a husband, I have other resources. I mean, you know, it’s just when I’m in that state, it’s just me in the past in some dilapidated place. That I can’t do anything about. Yeah, so that’s the pictures I, 

Todd: yeah. Plus you’ve already got dementia, right?

Client: With, with, you know, no [00:14:00] money, no, no energy, right? Eating bugs, 

Todd: and no wonder you can’t get off the couch. You’ve been, I’ve been swamped by some major images here. 

Client: Exactly. And when I’m not having the thought, I have plenty of energy and everything is fine, and I’m getting excited about it. But as soon as that thought comes in, oh.

Todd: Yeah. 

Client: Yeah. Just like, and that’s 

Todd: what we’re looking at, right? The effect of the thought on you. It’s a, it’s, it’s, it’s tangible. It’s, it’s noticeable. 

Client: Um, yeah. 

Todd: So who would you be without the thought, you’re never gonna be able to retire? 

Client: I, I’d be more present in the, in the reality that I’m in. Um, I’m still young, I’m still healthy, I still have lots of work.

I make decent money, my husband does too. We’re happy in the house. It’s still in good condition. There isn’t [00:15:00] anything that if it needed being done, we couldn’t do ourselves if necessary, just it would just be a matter of the amount of time and effort to do it. But you know, none of those conditions actually.

Amazing. It’s just you just see this number going high and all of a sudden you’re like, oh, yeah. And, and it’s like, well, yeah, you know, that’s still doable. Maybe even negotiable, you know, without, without the thought. It’s like, well, let me, let me see if I can negotiate something. 

Todd: Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. 

Client: Yeah. And if not, then I’ll just spend more money just taking, even if it means taking on a little bit more work to do that something’s being delivered.[00:16:00] 

Yeah. 

Todd: Yeah. So it’s quite clear the difference there between. With that thought. And without that thought, with that thought, this huge imagery and stress and without it, it’s kind of like, it, it’s workable. Right? 

Client: It’s workable. Yeah. And, and not even, you know, the thing I wanna do right now, the new roof, like I said, there’s nothing wrong with the one we have right now, not leaking.

There’s no urgency and you know, it doesn’t require any. You know, it doesn’t have to be an expensive roof. I mean, you know, there’s options. Yeah. So a turnaround. 

Todd: All right. So how would you turn this around? I’m never going to be able to retire ’cause of all these costs of the house.

Client: I, I [00:17:00] could retire whenever I feel, feel like it. Um. I can retire when I feel like it, when I’m ready to retire. 

Todd: Okay. So yeah, let’s look if there’s, see if there’s any examples of how that could be true in reality. 

Client: Um,

my retirement doesn’t have to mean that I couldn’t earn money. I could retire and still. You know, there’s a social security in the US which I would be able to collect that. I can collect it now, but it’ll be more in next year. And, um, I’m still capable of doing the work that I’m doing for which I make decent money.

So, you know, I can retire. It doesn’t have to be soon. It could, you know, I could. Work until I feel like I [00:18:00] have made enough or saved enough and then retire. Mm-hmm. I could also find alternate ways of maintaining the house, which are less expensive. 

Todd: Yep.

Like what are some of those options in case you were to explore them? 

Client: Um, well, the example of being the roof, um. I could hire, you know, local guys to do it for a lot less than a, than a than a big company. Right. Okay. Yeah. Right. Worst case scenario, like I said, there’s nothing wrong with it now, if it were to start leaking, there’s plastic everywhere.

You know, you just go and patch a leak. Yeah. Nurse along. You know, you can nurse a roof along for a long time. So you know, there’s nothing that. Could happen to the house, that could not it be repaired in some way. [00:19:00] And if the house burns down, I do have insurance. Right, 

Todd: right. 

Client: Yeah, 

Todd: exactly. I mean, we’re looking at all possibilities here, right?

It’s not right. I mean, I’ll, from 

Client: a, you know, a little bit of damage all the way to, you know, nothing left. Everything is replaceable. I, I prefer to keep the husband and the dog alive, that that would be a good thing. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. 

Todd: So I’m going to be able to retire even with this house and all of its expenses.

Client: Yeah. 

Todd: One is reducing the expenses a little bit different ways, like you just mentioned with the roof. Yeah. There is working a little longer. It doesn’t have to be complete retirement. Any other ways that. You might be able to even retire completely in case, uh, you wanted to and still, still maintain, have enough.[00:20:00] 

Client: Mm-hmm. I mean, I do have other resources available that this is a, a tight-knit community. Everyone pitches in and helps each other. So, you know, there’s, it’s like I’m not, I have a husband who’s very competent and, and. And, you know, can fix things. And so it’s like all of a sudden I’m not alone. You know, when I have that thought, all my, everything, the insanity ensues and all the existing resources suddenly disappear.

And it’s just me facing this and then it’s, without the thought, there’s it, it does, it can’t even get to the place where I’m afraid of. Yeah, yeah. 

Todd: Yeah. Okay, so I am gonna be able to retire. I don’t know if there are any other turnarounds, but take a look. 

Client: Um, 

Todd: I’m never gonna [00:21:00] be able to retire. That’s the original statement.

Client: I am, I may not want to retire. 

Todd: Ah, that’s a cool thing. Yeah. 

Client: Yeah. I may enjoy. Fixing up the house so much that I may actually decide that retirement isn’t necessary. And, and, um, I like what I do enough that it’s not like I’m looking forward to stopping

and there are a lot of different branches than what I do that I could branch off into something less physically demanding as I get older. Mm-hmm. So consulting, you know, or something like that. Right. So we, I, yeah. May not ever need or want to retire. 

Todd: Yeah. This story of retirement is just a big story. Like, oh, then I won’t do have to do [00:22:00] anything.

I’ll just be completely free. Um, it is a story, right? But. Uh, but it’s a story, right? Who would you be without that story 

Client: a certain age? And suddenly it’s like it becomes an option, but it’s certainly not a requirement, right? 

Todd: So that story, as good as it is, puts a lot of pressure. ’cause now I’ve gotta really push to get, make sure I have all the money and make sure the house is taken care of and all the like.

So now it’s like, make yourself miserable now so that you can have the story of not doing anything. 

Client: That’s what I’ve been doing. I’ve been accepting all this work because it’s like, oh, if I, if I just get it all done and I take all this work now, then I’ll be able to make this much money by. That birthday and then I can retire.

Right, right, right. And it’s like, why do I have, it doesn’t have to be on that birthday. It can be another year from there, another two years from there. It’s just at that time, I can collect this maximum amount that I would have. But [00:23:00] even that, you know, it’s like, yeah, I don’t have to retire. 

Todd: Exactly. So this opens up like just completely different options now.

It’s like I can retire, I might, I could retire and still have enough to work the house ’cause it doesn’t have to be the most expensive job. 

Client: Mm-hmm. Uh, 

Todd: on the house and I could just not want to retire. And that’s also fine. The house could be a project that goes on for years and um, and where’s the problem if I enjoy working?

Client: Yes, exactly. 

Todd: So it’s amazing how the mind like creates this problem and then like gets completely overwhelmed by it. It’s all and adds an deadline. 

Client: Yeah, completely.

Yeah. Actually have, okay. I have to just show you this. I have been [00:24:00] putting in my calendar every day how many days and where, where is it? How many days until I retire? 

Todd: Yeah, yeah. Like a prisoner scratching on the wall, you know, like, oh yeah. One 13. Exactly.

Yeah. Like my life begins then I’ll just, I’ll just hold my breath until, until I’m done, then I’ll be free. 

Client: Funny, I the funny part. Consider myself a relatively intelligent person. And then I have this thought, which eliminates all normal processing. That doesn’t make any sense. But in the, in the thought, I, there’s the believing the thought, there’s no thinking, 

Todd: right?

It’s just a want. I want to be free. And then I equate, equate, uh, retirement with freedom. And so. And [00:25:00] I have to do these things before I can retire. So I build this whole story that to get what I want, I’ll have to do these things. But, 

Client: and it even starts out as something fun. Like, oh, let’s put a, let’s put a project goal date for something.

But then it becomes panicky if, oh my God, we do that to ourselves. Right, exactly. 

Todd: Yeah, no, that’s, mm-hmm. I, I used to do that with my projects in my business, you know, I’d be like, oh my God, deadline, deadline. I’m gonna make this big thing happen by this date, and put a lot of pressure on myself. And then, um, and then I just kind of did some work like this, and like, why am I doing that to myself?

I can just do this and see how far it goes. And maybe it never finishes, or maybe it finishes on this schedule, not, and, and it feels so much more relaxed. 

Client: Yeah.

Yeah. 

Todd: Cool. Thanks. [00:26:00] Thank you. Yeah. Nice work. So any questions or anybody have any comments on that work before we close?

Client 2: Yeah. I like when Wendy said I. When she’s got the thought, she feels alone, and then without the thought, she’s connected. And I really resonate with that. So thank you for that. 

Client: Hmm. Yeah. That hit, when that hit was like, I have all these resources, I forget, exists in that, in the thought. Wow. Yeah, thanks for knowing.

Todd: If you would like to participate in open sessions like the one we heard just now, then go to the work as meditation.com and then open sessions, and you’ll see the schedule there. You can sign up and I would love to have you be a part of this [00:27:00] program. And while you’re there on the work as meditation.com, I invite you to check out the virtual retreats area.

This is something that I offer four times a year, and it’s a way to do the work. In an intensive way over a weekend, we meet on Zoom. You’ll find experienced facilitators, uh, and myself there, and we’ll be holding the space for you to go deeply into working on any subject that you’re interested in. So again, go to the work as meditation.com and then virtual retreats.

Next, I’m going to read one of my newsletter articles called Have You Questioned Your Financial Dreams?

What are Your Financial Dreams? Financial Dreams are wonderful. Who doesn’t love planning for and working towards a better future? [00:28:00] There’s a lot of good in it. But the problem comes when you start comparing those future dreams with reality, especially since it’s usually not clear how to get from today’s situation to those dreams.

In making the comparison, the mind often exaggerates the goodness of the dreams and the not so goodness of reality. That’s when discontent and stress began. How can I have the best of both worlds? One way to find the balance again between dreams and reality is to do the work. Make a list of your financial dreams one by one.

Lay them out in living color. Dream your dreams and write down every aspect of them using the format I want or I would like or I need. And make a detailed list of all these wants, and then question what you wrote. For example, doing that. Now [00:29:00] I come up with this list. I want to pay off the mortgage. I want to have money left over every month.

I want to have money in the bank. I want to travel. I want to buy some expensive photo gear. I want to work less hours. I want to have more vacation time. I want to be able to pay a bookkeeper. I want to feel comfortable about retirement. It can be so interesting to question a list of financial dreams like this.

For example, I want to pay off the mortgage. Is it true? What a great question. When you question what you want, you get to see all sides of it. Sure, I want to pay off the mortgage. Of course, that’s my dream. I’d love to have a rent free living situation, but the turnaround I don’t want to pay off the mortgage is also true.

I am actually perfectly fine paying the mortgage every month. Just like I paid the rent for years. In fact, it feels good to be responsible also. I don’t want to [00:30:00] overwork just to achieve this goal faster. That’s not worth it actually. So what if I never pay off the mortgage? I’ve got a place to live that’s more than enough actually for now, and I can always sell it if it’s too much for me.

So if we did pay off the mortgage, would it make that much difference to our quality of life? And I’ll make a note. I actually wrote this article years ago, and we have now paid off the mortgage. And I can say it is nice, but it’s not that huge of a difference. It’s just, okay, I don’t have that expense every month.

But money still comes up in different ways, just like it always did. So it’s interesting how, this is just an idea in my mind, you know, debt is bad. I must pay it off right away. Mortgage is a burden. Gotta get rid of it, you know? Who would I be without those thoughts? Without the thought? I would be happily paying my mortgage without thinking much of [00:31:00] it.

I would enjoy the house. I’d be using it instead of feeling like it’s not mine yet. That’s the value of questioning your dreams. The point is not to give up on your dreams, but to see both sides of them. Yes, I want that, and no, I don’t want that. Both sides are true. There are advantages to both, and it’s up to you to look for those advantages.

I encourage you to make a list of financial dreams or any dreams, doesn’t have to be financial and question what you wrote using the four questions and turnarounds of the work. And I’ll end with this quote from Byron Katie’s book, question Your Thinking, change the World. Can you really know that Your highest good is to be an artist?

How do you react when you believe that thought? You refuse to be content in a job less lofty than that. And when you get a job, you hate it because you think you’re just marking time until you can [00:32:00] devote yourself to your art.