Am I Doing The Work of Byron Katie Right? Inner Work Guidance for Highly Sensitive People

Client 2: Um. How do, how can you identify or like is it a feeling or how personally you identify that you’re actually doing the work the right way and not letting, like sometimes the tricky mind make you believe that you’re doing it right, but you’re not.

Todd: Good question. Yeah. The mind’s tricky. We know that we. We can all do lip service to the work. It’s certainly easy to do. Uh, I sometimes say maybe that’s a little different, but sometimes I say, I’m in the club of the work, but am I actually doing the work? That’s also, that’s a little different, but same idea like what is doing the work and how do you know if you’re doing the work as you say, the right way.

[00:05:00] Um. The work is four questions and it’s turnarounds. And so if you’re following the instructions of that, then basically you’re doing the work. If you’re going off on the sidetrack and getting into your story, getting lost in your story, a bit about what happened and all why you feel the way you feel, uh, then.

The main question is, are you answering the question? So the question is, is it true? Can you absolutely know it’s true? How do you react? What happens when you believe the thought? Who would you be without the thought? If I’m answering one of those questions, how do I react? Then it’s gonna look like this.

I’m angry. I turn away. I see images of the past when I was in a similar situation. I’m afraid of the future. I see some images there. I [00:06:00] treat the other person with a certain distance or who knows what. So these are reactions. Now compare that to, um, well that’s really interesting in that situation. Yeah, I was, I was angry.

So that’s reaction, uh, because I really felt strongly about that. That’s not the work now I’m saying. I’m explaining why I am feeling angry. That’s analysis. Analysis is not the same as the work. So if I notice that myself getting into analysis, then uh, not a big deal. Nothing wrong with analysis, but it’s a different thing than noticing the effect of the thought, which is how do I react?

I think he lied to me. I feel angry. So that’s doing the work. I’m connecting the. The thought, he lied to me with my reaction that comes out of that, [00:07:00] of I’m angry, but I don’t go into, I’m angry because that will be like elaborating on it. The real, because is coming from he lied to me. That’s, we just saw that.

How do you react when you think he lied to you? You feel angry, but. But if I start going off into, that reminds me of something and this is the, and the real reason for that anger is because of some. And do, do, do, do. You can end up getting, like, you can lose the thread of what’s actually happening. The power of the work lies in answering the question, and so that’s one aspect of it.

It can also happen in like question four or in the turnarounds where you’re. Saying, who would you be without the thought? He lied to me. And you’re, and the mind goes, yeah, but he did lie to me. Okay, so now I’ve stopped doing the work. Now I’m going into defensiveness. Or I’m kind of saying, but, but, but, but that’s, you know, it’s like I’m holding on [00:08:00] to the thought, the original thought.

So I’m still in question three. How do you react when you believe that, uh, that he lied to me? I’m defensive. I’m showing this right here. But in question four, it’s a different question. Who would you be without the thought? He lied to me. And, uh, so, so that is a mind bender. You’d be like, whoa, hold on. I have to think about that.

Who would I be without the thought? He lied to me. Wow. Okay. I hear those same words. And, and I, I also remember my own, my own thoughts about that. I. If I didn’t assume that was a lie, I would really be listening to him. I’d be saying, okay, tell me more. What, what, what was your experience there? And I would be objective.

I would not already have a conclusion. He lied to me. And then, you know, the mind will say, yeah, but I know he did lie to [00:09:00] me. And so then now I’ve stepped out of answering that question. But. It’s not all bad because I wanna be honest when I’m answering these questions as well, and maybe, okay, maybe it’s very high probability that he lied.

Maybe 99.999% true that he lied, and I, I have some pretty good evidence of that. So then I might soften the question a little bit and say, who would you be without the thought in terms of like, who would you be if you weren’t holding onto that thought so tightly and, and then. Oh, right, okay. I would be a little easier.

I would be a little more, more open-minded. I would be more aware of, I don’t know all the answers. I’m certainly not sure that he didn’t, that he lied a hundred percent. And there’s something I’m breathing a little easier, I’m a little less excited about it. Um, a little less ready to [00:10:00] fight about it. It’s a, it’s a dance between being honest with yourself and holding the question, and I don’t want to just use the question to shut myself up.

That’s also not doing the work. I can say, oh, no. Just, it’s not, who would you be without the thought? Who would you be? Without the thought be? Without the thought. Maybe I, it’s really hard for me to be without the thought. Mm-hmm. Then I have to be gentle with myself to see if I can find a way to be without the thought or hold it less, less tightly.

Or just imagine a little bit what it would be like. Um, this is all doing the work. This is answering the question. I’m trying to answer the question as honestly as I can, as truthfully as I can, but I’m not going away from answering the question. That’s when I’m not doing the work. If I go away from answering the question and I just say, yeah, it’s not true, you know, it, it is true.

He did lie to me. I can’t. [00:11:00] Answer that question, who would I be without the thought? I’ve just stopped doing the work. Doors are closed and I can go no further. Um, so the work is about noticing that when it happens, not bad, and then just being patient and just, you know, knocking on it on the door again, maybe asking in a different way, being gentle with myself.

Then turnarounds are the same thing. Just like the, just like the question four. They’re stretching me in a way that I’m not used to being stretched. If I notice that I’m being defensive or I’m saying, oh, that’s a, that’s an interesting turnaround. Oh no, that does, that’s not true at all. Uh, just like push away directly.

Push away. Then I’m not really doing the work. I’m not really. Considering if the opposite could be as true or truer. So it is a feeling like you mentioned, it’s a feeling of like, am I opening myself to these questions? Am [00:12:00] I allowing them to come in a little bit? Am I willing to play with them a little bit?

And it doesn’t mean that. That the turnaround is gonna be true. Maybe he did lie to me. Maybe it’s just actually true, and so I’m not going to pretend that it’s not true. I’m not to try to go into denial about it, but I am going to try to open my mind to the possibility that maybe it’s not true and look at it as objectively as possible.

That’s all I’m trying to do in the work. And that’s, there’s a certain openness that I bring when I’m doing my work that allows me to consider the very opposite of what I normally am thinking. And that’s what the work is all about. So I guess the feeling is, you know, where am I? Am I doing the right, the work, the right way?

Uh, the right way just means am I being honest with myself? [00:13:00] And am I being, and am I actually answering, excuse me, actually answering the questions. Uh, if I’m answering the questions as best I can with an open mind as best I can, and being as honest as I can, as best I can. Then I’m doing the work. It’s that simple.

If I’m being defensive, if I’m not answering the question, if I’m not being honest with myself, I’m being fake. You can pretend to do the work. That’s not the work either. If I’m not being honest, then uh, that’s not it. If I’m not answering the question, really, that’s not it. If I’m getting distracted by a million other things, that’s not quite it.

If I am, uh, if I’m. Rejecting the question that’s not quite it either. Rejecting the turnaround out of hand is not quite it. So it’s really just one thing. Am I answering the questions and am I being honest with myself while I’m doing that? And, um, and that’s it. [00:14:00] So you’ll feel it, you’ll feel when you’re not quite answering the questions.

Um. Doesn’t matter what outcome comes. Maybe you’re being honest as you can and you still don’t find any truth in the turnaround. That’s fine. I am doing the work. There’s no reason that says when you do the work, all the turnarounds must feel true to you and you must find the truth in them. That’s not true, that’s not necessary.

It’s just. Explore, try it out. See, and if you bring some kind of openness like that, then uh, you may find some very interesting things or you may find nothing and that’s fine, but it’s the way you approach. The work that makes it, you know, quote unquote right or not right. If I’m approaching it with an open mind to try to find out what might be there or what not, might not be there.

And I’m willing to see whatever I see, but I’m also honest about not [00:15:00] trying to pretend there’s more there than it really is there. Then that’s the sweet spot and that’s, that’s really doing the work. So anyway, that’s an overall general. You know, answer to that question. I don’t know if you had anything more specific about that.

Uh, but that’s, those are my first thoughts.

Client 2: Yeah, no, I think it’s perfect. Like, I feel, I kind of feel that part of like where you, sometimes you’re answering the question and you get distracted or some other thoughts get in the way, so you kind of get lost to it and then sometimes you come back, but sometimes you just get completely lost.

So. That’s kinda like interesting in the way that you’re saying, because that can happen while you’re doing it. So,

Todd: yeah, and it’s okay to get lost. It’s like, it’s like if you’re meditating and then your mind is off doing some thinking about something else, then that’s part of the meditation. You just realize, oh, right, I’m, I’m thinking other thoughts.

Let me come back to the meditation. So it’s the same thing with the work. The work is a meditation [00:16:00] and you’re going to get distracted out. You’re going to get defensive, you’re going to find all kinds of. Things where you step out of the work for a few minutes and then when you notice it, no problem. Okay, let’s begin the work again.

What was the question I was trying to answer? Alright. Who would I be without the thought and then just try again. So it can be very gentle process, but you just have to know what is the difference between when you’re doing the work and when you’re not doing the work and when as long as you’re clear, then you can step in and out.

And, and I, when I’m facilitating people, I will sometimes, um, somebody may need to step out of the work for a moment. They’ve just, it’s like if you hold ’em too tight, they’re going to explode almost sometimes, and they just run out of the work for a second. And then I’m thinking, oh yeah, we’re out of the work now.

But I’m just like talking about it with them for a few minutes and just chatting about something or laughing about [00:17:00] something, and then I’m like, okay, I think they’re ready. Let’s go back to the work again. And then we try again. And so this in and out of the work is a natural part of doing the work, but as much as is possible, as much as it’s comfortable.

Then I’m gonna hold somebody or hold myself in the actual questions. ’cause that’s the power of it. Everything else is just conversation and it has its own value. But there’s something special about the work when you’re actually answering these questions that just, you know, it just, it just cuts through things so, uh, so quickly.

So,

Client 2: yeah. Cool. Cool. Thank you.

Todd: Yeah. Great question. Thank you. All right. Anyone else have a question or wanna do a little bit of the work?[00:18:00]

Client: Um, Todd, I have a question if, if no one’s taking up on doing the work, I. Sure. Or if anyone else doesn’t have a question. Um, so I read an article, um, on your site. It was quite helpful. It was about judge your neighbor questions 2, 3, 4, the differences between the want should need. And I guess my question, um, is about question four.

I, I seem to on pretty much always on question four. I, my two go-tos are, I need them to understand or I need them to apologize. Um, and, um, perhaps a little bit more after that. That kind of ties to what I want. Um, and so I just wanna make, get your thoughts on, is that okay or do you have any, um. Input as far as like just kind of [00:19:00] expanding that and, um, you know, ideas or, or whatnot.

Uh, and I will say like when I do the work, looking at the emotions list and the sensations list helps me because it’s so, it’s quite expansive, so there’s a lot to choose from. And I think, like on question four, I’ve kind of gotten to, um, yeah, I just have, I have a hard time going beyond those. Things, which those things are useful for me for sure.

Yeah. Um, when I write or expand on it.

Todd: Okay. Yeah. I, those, those, uh, thoughts I need them to understand, I need them to apologize, are, uh, they fit very well into. Question four. Uh, so they’re right on target. It’s just that you feel like you’re kind of stuck with those and there’s no other options in a way.

Client: Yeah. It’s hard for me to think of much else, and it’s just like, well, this is comfortable. Yeah. If they, I’m offended, if [00:20:00] they apologize or understand, then that’s what I need, you know?

Todd: Yeah. So, and I think that, um, that can happen in any part of the work because it is the same four questions. And, and in this case, the judge, your neighbor worksheet, there’s six questions.

It’s, it’s a routine. There’s a certain routine about the work, um, and. You’ll find that, oh, I’ve been down this road before, and the mind will give the same answers that it did last time and, and that’s fine. It’s on target, but it doesn’t feel quite as fresh or quite as real. Um, and so what I like to do is, in general, what I like to do is think of.

Different ways of expressing that. Uh, and so sometimes I will, uh, I will look for different words or different, uh, slightly different variations that keeps it fresh, um, for me. But let’s look specifically at question four, which is what do you need the other person to think, say, feel, or do in order for [00:21:00] you to be happy?

You know, basically you got triggered by somebody. In a, in a stressful situation, they, uh, they did something and it got you, and you felt stressed, and you’re blaming them for that, and you’re feeling, uh, you’re feeling overwhelmed by that. So I. In the other parts of the worksheet, you’re putting down what you want, how you want them to be different.

You’re giving them advice line three, and when you get to line four of the judge your neighbor worksheet, you’re saying, okay, what do I need now from them in order to be happy? Because the mind believed that they caused my unhappiness. So the mind must also be believing that they could cause my me to be happy again.

Happy is a relative term. It’s not like, you know, ecstatic necessarily. But the way I like to think of it is they wounded me. Now, what could they do to address that wound and heal that wound for me? So that, that [00:22:00] word of wound really helps me to get close. On question four, what did they do to me? Right?

Line one is probably con, con contain what they did to me. They lied to me. Uh, and so. Having lied to me, what did they actually do to me? They, they hurt me. They made me lose trust. They made me feel, um, you know, made me feel stupid. And so it’s not enough for them to just kind of change somehow, let’s say they never did that to me again.

There’s still a wound there. They still did that to me. And that’s where the, I need them to apologize fits in so perfectly. What would I need them to do to address this wound? They did that. They did. What would I need them to do? I would need them. What’s really common for me is I would need them to, first of all, recognize, you know, [00:23:00] notice what they did, become aware of what they did, and then I would need them to, to, uh.

See the damage that it caused, uh, to me and then, and then I might need them to do, I don’t know. There may be some other things that, that I need them to be aware of or to notice about me, about them not wanting to hurt me about, um, anything related to that before they can even get to the place where they could apologize.

So I can build them a little step by step of what would I need from where they were, what, what would they need to do, uh, from starting from where they were, which was actually maybe belligerent to actually getting them to apologize. I would need them to see a few different things. I need them to really, uh, that they may need to [00:24:00] ask me.

I may need them to ask me about my experience. Uh, that might help me and it would help them so that then they can actually apologize. So these are the pieces, like a little bit of the details instead of just, oh, I apologize. Because the problem with apologize is that it’s, uh, it’s, we were all taught it’s kids okay, apologize to your brother, apologize to your sister.

And they were like, oh yeah, I’m sorry, but you know, we didn’t really mean it. And so we’ve kind of gotten this. There’s a, there can become a cheapness about apologizing. That doesn’t quite satisfy me. But when somebody takes all these other steps of really asking me, saying, you know, I think I really hurt you.

What did, what was your experience there? Uh, what, uh, you know, I might need them to. Explain to me what they were thinking. That might really help me also to heal that wound. So [00:25:00] looking for what are all the different, maybe smaller steps that would lead up to an apology Can, uh, give you a lot of different need statements that could be interesting, different.

Unusual and maybe even more powerful than just the apologize, uh, part itself. So those are a few ideas. That’s kind of where, where I go, it’s gonna be different for each, each situation, but I’m, I’m really thinking about, okay, they did their, their. I call it, sometimes call it the crime or, or maybe the offense.

They did this offense to me and they caused me some damage. I need them to fix that and I’m gonna need them to take some steps that are really specific. I’m gonna need them, first of all, internally to do some things, maybe some, some things they have to ask me, and then I’m gonna need them to apologize.[00:26:00]

Sometimes it’s a very specific kind of apology. Like, I need them to, if they publicly did something to me, I need them to publicly apologize. Like it really specific, uh, so each situation is gonna be different, but that’s how I approach it. I’m just asking myself, what is that really gonna get? Is that really gonna do it for me?

If they, if I, if they just understand and apologize, is that enough for me? Um. Can I spell it out in more detail for them? Uh, are there any specifics that would really help in this case? And all those kinds of things can generate different need statements that you can write on your, on your line for, uh, the judge, your neighbor worksheet.

So those are a few brainstorming ideas. What, what do you think as you’re listening there?

Client: I know that sounds good and that one thing that just caught eye when you were talking and I think you said take some steps and. What came to my mind was like, take some accountability. You know, take some take, you know, [00:27:00] responsibility.

So like what would be the type of things I would need them to do for that, you know?

Todd: Yeah. Yes. Yes, exactly. Like they’re just getting away scot free with hurting you, and like, let’s get, let’s, I need them to take some responsibility. And that would be very specific in certain situations. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So the more you get into the specifics, the more your answers.

Are going to feel alive to you, are gonna feel meaningful to you. Um, and they’ll still be probably in the same ballpark of, I need them to understand and I need them to apologize. Yeah. But there’s more details. It fleshes it out and that’s what makes it come, uh, come alive and become interesting and become, uh.

More useful instead of becoming like a cliche, like, you know, all my statements are, I need them to understand. I need them to understand. I need them to understand, or I need them to apologize. I need them to apologize. I need them to apologize. Yeah. And then the mind just sort of turns off after a while [00:28:00] ’cause Oh yeah, I’ve already done this one.

Client: Yeah, yeah,

Todd: yeah. Like that. Of course you can work the same thought a million times and it can be different every single time if you’re really careful with it and really slow with it and just take your time and look at the situation that it came from. Um, but what I find is with this kind of approach, you can have a little bit of both.

There is a certain commonality. Yeah. It’s in the ballpark. Of, I need them to understand and apologize, but there’s more specifics coming out and that keeps my attention. And it also deals with specific elements of a particular situation that, uh, when you look at them, when you turn them around, when you question them, it’s gonna bring out some really interesting turnarounds like that.

Client: Yeah. Well, and as far as the repetitiveness, I mean, I feel like, I mean, that is. Part of the work. ’cause like in question six, when you say, I’m willing to, you know, have this [00:29:00] again, it means you’re willing to do the work again, right? Uhhuh? Yeah. When it comes up again. So

Todd: that’s okay.

Client: Right.

Todd: It is nothing. The work is repetitive in a way.

Yeah. And there’s nothing wrong with that. And there’s nothing wrong with having the same answer for this. Uh, piece of work that you’re doing be, it’d be, it’s the same answer that you had two days ago when you did a, a similar piece of work. Yeah, it’s okay to have the same answers, but what makes it different is that the situation you’re working yesterday and the situation you’re working today, there may be different situations or you’re, you’re, you’re looking at it slightly differently, and so your answers have a flavor of repetitiveness, repetitiveness, and a flavor of newness.

Together. That’s usually my experience. Both. Yeah. Yeah,

Client: yeah. Thanks Todd. That was helpful.