Stop Copying Turnarounds: How to Trust Your Own Inner Work as a Highly Sensitive Person

Todd: [00:00:00] In the work of Byron Katie, the first thing we do is identify a stressful situation, and once we’ve found a stressful situation, we look for the stressful thought or the stressful thoughts that are causing that experience of stress. Then the third phase is to go through and question those thoughts and start to look for different ways of seeing them or different ways of understanding the situation.

I. Usually there’s no trouble identifying a stressful situation, but identifying the thought can sometimes take a little bit of patience and presence and quietness. This is a meditation, and so to support you in this process of listening to yourself and identifying what are the stressful thoughts that are.

Running in a particular [00:01:00] stressful situation. I’ve written a book called Finding the Door to Inquiry, and in this book you’ll find lots of ideas of how to go from, I’m really not sure what’s bothering me to some really concrete ideas of what are the stressful thoughts that you can actually question using the work of Byron Katie.

So to find more about this book, go to the work as meditation.com and then go to finding the door to inquiry.

Client: Yeah. Something that’s going on with your body. Let’s see. Your body being your doctor’s business, and, i’m always confused about this because I do not necessarily always agree with what doctors think and the way they 

Todd: welcome to Wiggle Room, a podcast where we start with stress and look for ways to [00:02:00] turn it around.

And we use the work of Byron Katie, a way to identify stressful thoughts. And then question those thoughts and see if there’s another way of looking at the same situation. I’m Todd Smith and on the program today, we have an interesting discussion about something that Byron Katie sometimes says. She’ll often say this in a particular context that.

Her body is not her doc, or sorry, her body is her doctor’s business. And she experiences a lot of freedom in seeing it this way. It’s a turnaround for her, but someone brings up a question that they don’t quite understand it or doesn’t make sense or somehow it’s counterintuitive. And so we discuss a little bit what.

What could be different ways of looking at this particular expression and how to find sense for yourself for what makes sense to [00:03:00] you. So that’s really the main focus of the open session this week. And you’ll find several different interesting ideas coming out of this discussion.

Then after the open session recording, then I will be reading a newsletter article called Dealing with the Mental Aspect of Chronic Pain. So let’s dive into the work of Byron Katie together. It’s as always a simple, powerful way to question what you think. And in this case, we’re not actually doing the work of Byron Katie, but we’re talking about the work and we’re talking about Byron Katie herself, and we’re playing with some turnarounds and looking at the spirit of what the work of Byron Katie actually is.

So as always I share the unedited recordings so that you can experience exactly how this discussion went through

Client: it. It was a question that came up some time [00:04:00] ago that bar and Katie talks about when yeah, something is going on with your body. Let’s see here. Your body being your doctor’s business. I’m always confused about it. Because I do not necessarily always agree with what doctors think in the way they deal with things.

So I would yeah. Enjoy to hear your. Your interpretation of that? Like how to see that if you 

Todd: Yeah. I’m hearing an echo here. Let me just can everybody just check and make sure you’re on mute? Just before I Yeah, that sounds better. There was some echo. Okay. So yeah the.

And Katie says that from time to time, the bo your body is your doctor’s business, or I think she probably puts it in first person. My body is my doctor’s business or something like [00:05:00] that. And the way I see that is a turnaround for her. And it may to her. In that it is something that she it balances something that she was doing in the opposite.

She may have been worrying about her health, trying to control it. And for her, that turnaround, balanced it so that she could relax a little bit and just let it be more her doctor’s business, I would guess. It doesn’t mean that she’s. Not paying attention to her body. But that there’s a, there’s some I don’t know what she’s, what it means to her, but my guess is it’s just providing some balance.

Okay, let’s let the doctor take care of that. I can’t take care of everything, so let’s let the doctor take care of that and that works for her. And it may be that. Taking care of her [00:06:00] body in a medical sense is not her highest priority. Whereas for other people, medicine or taking care of the body is a, an important part of their life, like where they’re, what they’re really interested in.

So I don’t think of this as some kind of an absolute that doesn’t mean that now you don’t. You just have to forget about taking care of your body and let the doctor take care of it only. I look at my experience. I like to take care of my body. I’ve always have I like to learn about how the body works.

I like to I like to pay attention to what kind of foods work for me and what don’t, and what kind of routines work and what doesn’t, and. I’ve studied I studied Ayurveda for a while, which is a traditional medicine from India. And I loved it. I loved it. It’s very interesting to me.

So I [00:07:00] wouldn’t say, oh, I’m just gonna turn over my body to. To a doctor just because they’re a doctor. That doesn’t make sense to me. I don’t do it that way, but there’s certain times and places where I might do that. Like for example, like right now I’m noticing like my teeth are shifting around in my mouth and I’m thinking.

What’s going on? I don’t know what’s going on. I have a missing tooth and maybe the teeth are all changing around and I take good care of my teeth, so there’s not any problem on that level. But my dentist said, oh, I don’t see any concerns when he went into, when I saw him like a month ago, but I have some concerns.

Something’s not, something’s changing there that doesn’t work for me. And my next step is I’m thinking I might go see an orthodontist to see, okay, is there something wrong or is there something easily fixable, or what are [00:08:00] my options here? So I’m still holding the ball, I’m still taking care of myself, but there is a place where I will say, you have more expertise than I do.

I’m going to gain, I’m gonna come to you and I’m going to listen to you, and I’m gonna hear what you have to say. I’m gonna say, yeah, that’s, if I decide to get braces, for example, then I’ll say you take care of that. I’m not going to take care of that. But it’s a difference between my business and their business.

Like my business is who I decide to go see, whether I decide to participate in what they offer, all of those things. And their businesses to do that job. So if I can keep those two distinct, then for me it works really well. But I don’t, it doesn’t work for me to just say only only my doctor will take care of my health.

It doesn’t work for me. Yeah. 

Client: [00:09:00] Yeah, it’s the same for me. It was almost like she was saying like, you have your business. And the other person’s business, God’s business and then the doctor’s business or something. It was really confusing in a way, but 

Todd: yeah. Yeah. 

Client: How you say it makes more sense to me actually.

Yeah. 

Todd: And I think that the thing with business, the different kinds of business, my business, your business, God’s business is that, the difference is between my business and other people’s business is that my business is what I can control. Your business is what I can’t control. So anything that I can’t control about the doctor, I will give that to their business.

I’ll let them have it because for me to try to change them or try to run. They run what they’re running, change how they’re thinking, change how they’re acting is very stressful. But just [00:10:00] because they have things that I can’t control doesn’t mean that I don’t have things that I can control.

I don’t know if I said that but the idea is I can control certain things and there’s things I can’t control, so I let go of the things I can’t control. But I don’t necessarily let go of the things that I can control, and that feels peaceful to me. That feels like I’m gonna take responsibility for what I can do and I’m going to allow the doctor to take care of responsibility of what I can’t do, and somehow there’s a partnership in that works for me.

Client: Yeah. There, there’s this one more thing coming up when you share this, like I, I think at some point she says my body is not my business. 

Todd: Yeah. And 

Client: So that’s where it gets really Yeah. So 

Todd: confusing 

Client: because like I, I can see from a [00:11:00] certain point of view it like I’m not the body, but yeah.

So I don’t know. I don’t know if you have anything to add in 

Todd: Yeah, sure. And my take on that is Byron Katie’s functioning from a really let go place, like a really almost advanced kind of place way of seeing where I think she would say nothing is my business. I’ve heard her say that actually.

So this is. Non-identification with anything, right? Not identifying with doing or being anything other than just I am. And the body seems to do what it does. The mind, what it does. The doctors do, what they do, life does what it does. And none of it’s my business. I’m just here. But it’s a very different experience than.

Many of us have I think I am the one doing things, so then I have to talk in terms of my [00:12:00] business and your business and the doctor’s business. But I. The principle is the same. Whether, whatever you’re identifying yourself as then that’s your business. Whatever you’re not identifying as, that’s not your business.

So that may change over time. And for her, she may find that. Nothing is her business. Her body’s not her business, and she just doesn’t worry about any of it. It’s great. This is a very free place to be. And then she’s still very effective in action. So it doesn’t mean she’s just a lump sitting somewhere.

She’s amazing. But we have to stay at our own place of evolution. If I’m not identifying, or sorry, if I am identifying with. My, my body or with my ability to do things. If that’s where I am, then I have to be honest with that and then just see where’s my business within that world.

So it’s you can’t compare different states of evolution. The [00:13:00] H one has its own experience, but the work will hold you. No matter where you are, the idea of my business, your business will work in different kind of experience, different levels of consciousness, would you say? It’s just, you just have to be clear what is my business?

So that’s really the first question, what is my business? And you may ask that self to aspect of yourself and you’ll say, my business is to. Research something about my body. Great. Then you’re in your business. Or another person might say, my job, my business is to find a good doctor and let them do the job.

Or Byron Katie might say, my business is nothing, and somehow doctors are coming and they’re going and they’re telling me things and they’re not. And the whole thing just, it happens by itself and who cares, right? So that may be her experience. I don’t know. The main [00:14:00] thing is, am I arguing with the way things are?

Am I trying to control something I can’t control? That’s gonna cause conflict. And if I just stop doing that and the work will show me how to by showing me the turnaround, if I can back out of somebody else’s business, then I will experience that as more peaceful. And that’s all. But it’s never saying.

But don’t be interested in doctors. No. It’s just saying, how are you experiencing your. Your doctor, is it stressful or is it peaceful? Is taking care of your body like naturally a fit for you? Or is it something that, that you’re getting caught up in, and getting like overly stressed about? So the work is only about that stress.

I feel stress, then I’m going the opposite direction and. I think that’s all that, that this turnaround points to. But I can understand [00:15:00] the confusion because i’m, it doesn’t mean I become a lump, I don’t become like a, I don’t just have a drool hanging down my chin and think nothing matters.

Okay. Or I’ll just trust completely. I’m gonna go to this crazy doctor, and then I’ll just do whatever they say. That’s not the idea. Yeah. 

Client: Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. It was helpful to, to hear that. I think that there’s still something that, that I’m not fully getting, but I’m I cannot really grasp it.

But yeah, I think for the most part it’s really clear actually. And I don’t want to keep talking. To, I was looking for so I’m gonna let go and if it comes up later, I’ll, 

Todd: yeah, if it comes back something more, then bring it up again. We’ll think about it together. Cool. Thanks. All right. So any other question or any, [00:16:00] anyone want to do a little bit of the work?

Client 2: It’s more a comment, about this body idea. The body as, a thing that gives you signals about stress. And so I like it from that perspective as a way into the work, the, it’s the body that’s telling you something’s off. Sometimes I get a signal [00:17:00] from the body first before the thought, I think.

Todd: Yeah, me too. Yeah. In fact, emotions, if you really want to think about it, are really body sensations. So the body is telling me something’s off before I even have the thought. Often, at least it might be simultaneous, but I notice the emotion or I notice the body sensation, or I notice something going on in my body.

Usually that’s what catches my attention. And so that’s why like Byron Katie often calls it the alarm clock, right? Stress. The alarm clock that wakes you up. Oh, something’s going on. What am I thinking? What am I believing? And then you look for, okay, what is the thought? And then you can question it from there.

But yeah, I agree that the body is communicating and it’s very am amazingly sensitive. It can detect. Slightest imbalances. Not [00:18:00] just physical imbalances, but mental imbalances. It can detect those and tell me, and then I know there’s something to look at. Yeah. 

Client 2: And I love how it’s such a, it’s such a integral component to exploring question three.

Todd: Yeah. How do you react? What bodily sensations do you notice? Yeah. Oh, there’s tension here. There’s a shut down here. There’s a headache. There’s a million different reactions that are physical. And I also love that question three ’cause it shows me the effect of the thought, right?

How a thought is giving these physical. Reactions and it just makes it really clear. It makes it really clear. Not only tells me what’s going on, there’s something stressful going on, but going on. But just amazing how powerful a thought can be to cause that kind of experience. [00:19:00] Yeah. See, the cool thing is we don’t need like some kind of magic, I don’t know, magic’s not the right word, but like some kind of.

Electron microscope or whatever to see what the thoughts are or some kind of, we don’t need some super scientific procedure to get to see where’s, what’s going on. The body will tell you it’s super sensitive. You just have to listen. And that’s what the work of Byron Katie is all about, listening to myself.

Then I’ll find, okay, that feels off, what’s going on? And then I’ll question it and then, oh, that feels better. Oh, good. So I’m listening. Listening. I’m fine tuning to what feels true to me. And that’s why, going back to that first question about the body and doctor and everything, it’s, that’s Byron Katie’s turnaround.

But find your own turnaround. Listen to your own. [00:20:00] Your own experience and let it show you where to go. Don’t take even Byron Katie’s insights and just borrow them, find them. See if it makes sense for you. Te she says it over and over. Don’t believe me. Test it for yourself. I must’ve heard her say that a thousand times.

Test it for yourself. Don’t believe me. Test it. Find your own answers. Those are the ones that will set you free. She’s gi, she’s just reminding us that we have the power. We’re the ones that can set ourselves free. She’s just showing you how it worked for her and giving you little pointers along the way that you can try out, but you have to be the one that’s the final tester for all of that.

That’s what leaves me with the most confidence in this work when I’m not following anybody. I’m not, this is not, she’s not a leader and I’m the follower. No, [00:21:00] she’s just saying, here’s what worked for me. Check it out, test it out, and ask yourself, see what you can find. For me, that’s yeah, I can follow that because I’m not following anything.

I’m following myself, which is the one that I’ve been avoiding following my whole life. Yeah. I can’t fault anyone who tells me to follow myself. That’s, that works for me.

Yeah. So what was your question again? April? Your comment again? It was about the body. Anything more you want to add to that?

Client 2: No, I think it was just tying into Sarah’s question that just made me think that. Often the body is my way in. Yeah. So in that way it is my business and it’s a really valuable tool that I use. [00:22:00] 

Todd: Yeah. What a great way of looking at it. So here is the body is my business. This is turning that around to see that’s also true.

I love that. The body is my business. It’s what tells me. Something, there’s something more to look at or that there’s something I need to pay attention to. Maybe just physical, like for me, I’m noticing my teeth. Okay, pay attention to that. Don’t just ignore it. Or maybe it’s an emotion. Pay attention to that.

What’s going on? So my body is my way in, and it is my business in that sense, and my body’s not my business. Also, if there are things I can’t. Control with, or that I decide to hand over to a doctor to help me with, then I allow that to be true too. But so always, I feel like I’m getting closer to the truth when I see it’s true and it’s [00:23:00] not true, right?

When I see both sides, then I feel like I’m I’m in good. I’m in a good place of understanding a little bit. Yeah, no absolutes. There’s no this is the way it is. And anything other than that, isn’t it that whenever I see that, I think something’s missing. Here, let me look a little closer.

Client: Yeah. I like to be reminded of that again, like I, I seem to be always tempted to go to the one side or the other side, it seems yeah. Yeah. So that’s helpful to be reminded of. 

Todd: Yeah. I think that’s our tendency as humans, we tend to do that. We’re like, okay, if it isn’t black, then it’s white.

Or if it isn’t white, it’s black. And we go back and forth, flip-flopping from one side to the other, and you can easily do that even when doing the work. You take it. One thought, and then turn it around. And then you get stuck on the opposite, on the turnaround, as [00:24:00] if that’s only true and the other one’s not true anymore.

And like he’s mean, and then turn around. I’m mean, oh God. Oh, and then I’m stuck over there. I’m mean I’m terrible, maybe I need to balance it out with he’s mean, so that we can be okay. We’re both mean or we’re just humans. And. So that’s the thing. If it’s starting to look like it’s absolute, if I’m taking things too, absolutely.

Then I’ll feel it. You probably felt it, Sarah when you were like, there’s something off about this. Something doesn’t quite work. Even though I’m hearing it from Byron Katie, like something isn’t quite right. So look like you, when you go to one extreme or the other, it feels like imbalance. Probably it’s something in the body or the emotions that’s letting you know that doesn’t feel a hundred percent.

So go check it out. See if there’s another way of seeing it that is, that feels more balanced. That’s what we’re looking for. [00:25:00] Yeah. My body is my responsibility and my body is my doctor’s responsibility. Somewhere. When those two work together, that starts to feel like truer to me.

But each case is unique. So sometimes I need that hard opposite just to balance out the original statement. So I may go to the other side and it just feels like relief because I was so stuck on this side. But my analogy is if you’re a whitewater rafting and you’re about to tip over this way, then if you take a stroke here, it’s like a turnaround.

You, you go off the other way that’s gonna feel great ’cause you’re now not going in the water. But if you don’t do anything more, you’re probably gonna go off [00:26:00] on the other side. So you have to constantly be. Noticing where the imbalance is and then creating more balance. And it’s never done. It’s whitewater rafting.

So life is whitewater rafting. It’s always changing. Then you think you need just one stroke on this side, but maybe you need two strokes or three just to get balanced. And then that’s the way I consider this work, is just constantly checking with myself what feels like balance. Where’s the imbalance?

How can I turn that around? I. Not turn it around too much and then find the Find my way. Yeah. Cool. Discussion. Thank you guys. Yeah.

If you would like to participate in open sessions like the one you just heard, then go to the work as meditation.com and go to the open sessions page. You can see the schedule there. You can sign up. If you sign the release form, you can [00:27:00] participate and then you can bring your own questions or participate in our discussions or do the work with me.

And while you’re at the work as meditation.com, I also encourage you to check out some of my Do It yourself courses. For example, the Work 1 0 1 is now a Do It Yourself course, as well as the living with Money course. Both of these can be found at the work as meditation.com. Next, I’m gonna read one of my newsletter articles called Dealing with the Mental Aspect of Chronic Pain.

Chronic pain can leave you feeling alone. Depleted, hopeless, depressed, or angry. Chronic pain can be a constant companion for many people. Pain is a part of daily life. It could be back pain, joint pain, stomach pain, intestinal pain, tinnitus, [00:28:00] headache, or pain in any part of the body. What makes it chronic is that it doesn’t go away.

Many people have been living with pain for years. The first thing to do with pain is to work with doctors and health practitioners to alleviate the physical pain if possible. Chiropractic is very helpful with back pain and headaches, and there are many well-trained doctors and health practitioners offering modalities to help with chronic pain.

Doing some research is often well worth the effort, but there’s also a lot of psychology that goes along with pain. The mind can make pain worse. It can put you through the gamut of emotions, which only intensifies the pain. So in addition to getting good medical attention, addressing the mind is a valuable part of managing pain.

There are many modalities to work with the mind. [00:29:00] Meditation, for example, can be a big help. I have been using transcendental meditation since I was very young, and I find it to be a very effective way of calming the mind and opening the heart, and letting go of stress. Self-inquiry is another tool that I use to free my mind and open my heart.

Specifically, I used the work of Byron Katie. A simple way to identify the thoughts that are causing me stress and to question them and turn them around. This powerful practice of self-inquiry has unraveled countless stories and beliefs that were causing me stress. Here are some ways to use the work of Byron Katie with pain.

All you have to do is listen to what your mind is saying about chronic pain. The stressful thoughts are sitting there ready to be written down and questioned using the four questions and turnarounds of the work. So the first thing I do is sit down with a piece of [00:30:00] paper. I close my eyes and I start listening.

Whenever I hear a stressful thought, I write it down. You can question anything about the pain from the statements of fact to the interpretations of those facts. Here’s an example from when I used to have chronic back pain. Fact, my back hurts interpretation. It will never go away. It’s constant. It’s only going to get worse.

I no longer can enjoy life. I have to be very careful. It’s not fair. I can’t handle it. It’s unbearable. It SAPs all my energy. I want it to go away. I don’t ever want it to come back. I’m getting old. I wish I was young again. As you can see, there are two sources of pain here. The physical [00:31:00] body and the mind’s interpretations.

In my experience, the interpretations are even more debilitating than the physical pain, and now I have both. Questioning my thoughts about pain. In addition to consulting practitioners to help with the physical body, I then questioned the thoughts I wrote down about the pain. I sometimes questioned the actual fact my back hurts, and more often I question all of the interpretations.

My story about the chronic pain, this is what is causing my emotional pain. To help identify these interpretations. I often use the prompt and it means that, for example, my back hurts and it means that, one, it’s only going to get worse. Two, I can no longer enjoy life, and three, my life is over. Then I question each of these thoughts that I wrote down.[00:32:00] 

If you want support in doing this work, then sign up for a private session with me or join our online community called Inquiry Circle. And here is a quote from Byron Katie from her book, A Thousand Names for Joy. All suffering is mental. It has nothing to do with the body or a person’s circumstances. You can be in great pain without any suffering at all.

So thanks for listening, and be sure to subscribe to this podcast. Share it with a friend, post something on social media. Leave a review for the podcast wherever you happen to listen. Stop by the work as meditation.com. You can get my newsletter there. You can participate in open sessions like the one we just heard today, and you’ll find hundreds of articles on the work of Byron Katie there, as well as information about the.

Different courses and [00:33:00] programs that I offer, including our community called Inquiry Circle. So thank you for being with me and I look forward to being with you again in another episode of Wiggle Room.