What If the Turnaround Feels False? Inner Work Insights for the Highly Sensitive Person

Client: Uh, I have a question and I wrote it down to make it a little easier.

Client 2: Okay, great.

Client: So I’ll read it to you. Um. I did the, uh, I was doing the work on a situation with a friend and, um, my, uh, my initial phrase was, [00:04:00] I’m surprised and indignant with her because she thinks I’m not holding the agreement we made.

She literally wrote that in a text message. So that’s, that’s not an interpretation of mine, it’s what she wrote.

Todd: Mm-hmm.

Client: So I can easily describe how this thought she thinks I’m not holding the agreement we made affects me when I believe it, and also who I would be without a thought. But the t, the turnaround to the opposite doesn’t work for me.

Not even when I would think of it in a less literal way. Um, I’m, I’m certain all the fuz is just a misunderstanding, but not sure she sees it that way as well. So I, uh, she doesn’t think, I’m not holding the, the agreement we made doesn’t work. If I can still read it in the text message. And this is actually the first time that a turnaround really doesn’t work for me.

Does that mean that I just don’t see it? Or could it be [00:05:00] that it really just doesn’t work And consequently I can, it can be skipped. The other turnarounds, by the way they do work, like I think she’s not holding the agreement we made. That’s obvious to me. And I think I’m not, I’m not holding the agreement.

We made also true. Because I feel uncertain about what someone else means by holding an agreement and which agreement that is in their eyes. So it’s, it’s just the turnaround that is the opposite. That really doesn’t work. Not even in the, in the not literally sense.

Todd: Yeah.

Client: Yeah.

Todd: Yeah. So I love that you found this.

Um, it is something that can happen, especially when you’re dealing with a. A fact, right? You have the text proof, right? It’s proof that she thinks I’m not holding the agreement we made because she wrote that, right? So, um, what to do with that? The first [00:06:00] thing I think is to hold the idea that not every turnaround has to be true.

I think that’s really important to not try to force it. Uh, maybe I’ll find something, but maybe there is nothing and uh, I can live with that. So. That’s the first thing, just the context to begin with. If I’m trying to make every turnaround work, then I’m gonna be forcing it. I’m going to be faking it. I’m going to be, uh, pushing in some way, and that’s not really the spirit of doing the work.

So, but then, okay, once I have that idea, I don’t. Might not be true at all, then I will still look. I’ll still give it a chance. I’ll look and maybe I find something and maybe I don’t find something. Um, I’m just thinking now as I look at this, she thinks I’m not holding the agreement we made. She doesn’t think I’m not holding or she thinks, what is it she doesn’t think.

I’m not holding the [00:07:00] agreement we made. Um.

Yeah. So how could that be true? Maybe I’m just imagining like if, if, if I can just try to find some little tiny thing like maybe she thought it when she texted it, but she changed her mind and she doesn’t think it now, or maybe she said that so directly. But some people, they, they sound so strong when they say something, but it’s not so strong for them on the inside.

Maybe I’m interpreting it to be more strong than it is or something, I don’t know. But these are just like, yeah, actually those,

Client: yeah.

Todd: Mm-hmm. Go ahead.

Client: Yeah. Yeah. I think, uh, what you just said, those two examples, they [00:08:00] sound like they could be true. Especially since I wrote, uh, I, I replied to her, um, text and explained what I thought it was the agreement and she, she didn’t text me back.

So, I dunno, maybe, maybe she, maybe she changed her mind. I don’t know.

Todd: Yeah. Could be. So this is also an kind of example where. I call it examples of possibility. I don’t know if it really, if it’s true or not, that she changed her mind or something, but it’s possible and just holding that possibility softens something in my own heart, and that’s all I’m doing here.

I’m just looking for any, if there’s any other possible way of seeing this differently, but I have to keep in mind. There might not be anything, and I might still, [00:09:00] even after finding examples, still doesn’t feel like it’s satisfying enough and I may leave the turnaround saying, as far as I know, it’s still, uh, the turnaround is not so much true.

Original statement is a little bit truer. And, and that’s Okay. So an alternative that can happen exactly for this precise. Type of situation is the turnaround, which some people don’t like. Um, I’ve even heard Byron Katie not promote this turnaround because people confuse it sometimes, but I still like it in certain situations just like this.

And that is the, the like, yay turnaround, right? She thinks I’m not holding the agreement we made. Mm-hmm. Yay. How is that a good thing? So what it’s doing is it’s turning around without changing the fact. Maybe she really, I. Thinks you’re not holding the agreement. But even without changing that fact, I can [00:10:00] change the energy of it from something bad to something good.

And that’s enough. That’s enough. So that gives us several options, right? We have that turnaround, the kind of yay, uh, we have the turnaround to the self or have the turnaround to the other. There’s enough places here to find some freedom. I don’t have to get. That door broken down that she really thinks the opposite of what I thought.

It’s not necessary. Um, so we’re just exploring. We’re just looking for ways of seeing the same situation that is truthful. That’s why it has to be genuine, but also that, uh, is a more peaceful way of seeing it. That’s all we’re looking for. Um, so that, that would be my approach to it. Nothing more. And, um, if, if I don’t see anything more, I just keep moving.

It’s good enough.

Client: Thank you.

Todd: Yeah, welcome. [00:11:00] Okay. So any other, any other thoughts or questions on that? Um, or any other questions or pieces of work you wanna do for anyone?

Client 3: I have a question on, uh, uh, I have a problem, um, saying no to the people, but I am, have thoughts on me, um, more than the other person. So, um, I have, I have, uh, some problems to convert that, those thoughts. On the other person because I know that, uh, it’s better to do the work on other people, to judge people other than judging myself.

Uh, it’s a little bit difficult in in that [00:12:00] case because, um, I have a situation on, uh, a person that is addicted to drugs and. He keep asking me money. Um, and some, sometimes I, I gave him, but I made a mistake because you, you think to, to, to make a, um, a good thing. But one day he, he says, give me one euro the other day, two euros the other day, 10 years, 50 year.

And, uh, but, um. I, I am, I’m not able to, to, to, to judge me, judge him. Um, other than judging myself. I, I don’t know if you, if you got it, Todd. Um, yeah.

Todd: So I

Client 3: tried to do that [00:13:00] and, and, um, I, I wrote, uh. He takes advantage of my weakness, but I don’t know if it’s, it’s, it’s, it’s, it’s, uh, the, the, the right thought I’m not sure about.

Mm-hmm. So I wanna ask you if, if there, there are some tips to, to, to, to, to check the right thought. Um. But remaining in the, in the judge, judging, judging the other person. Mm-hmm. I don’t want to, I don’t want to do, to do the work on my on, on me, on myself, but I wanna, I wanna learn to do the work on the, on the other person.

But in this case, I, I think that it’s, um, a matter of anxiety. And, uh, um, I found that the work is [00:14:00] very useful for anger because when you are angry, you judge the other person obviously. But when you are anxious, you judge yourself other than the other person. And, uh, you risk not to solve the anxiety problems.

Todd: Hmm.

Client 3: I don’t know if you got it. I think I got it. Yeah. In English, but

Todd: a good question. Yeah, I, I like it. Good question. So a couple things. I think the first thing is that there are a lot of advantages to doing the work on another person. Because you end up seeing yourself in the mirror. You see things about yourself, you don’t expect.

It’s a, there’s a lot of advantages that come from that. Um, but I don’t rule out, I. Doing the work on myself. Sometimes I don’t do it [00:15:00] all the time, but I do it sometimes. And sometimes that’s just the thought that is, there is a self-judgment thought or something about myself and um, I. I still do that work.

Like I trust that my stress will show me what I need to work, and I don’t worry too much about it. If you’re new to the work, it can be more challenging because there’s very few turnarounds, usually one turnaround, and there’s, uh, sometimes less distance because you’re judging yourself and all of that. So there are again, a lot of advantages to judging the other person, but.

You don’t have to completely avoid it, right? It’s not a, it is not a hundred percent avoid, just, just, um, trust yourself. And then, uh, sometimes it might be you’re judging yourself, but to get to your question, which is how, if you want to do it, judging another person, in this case, another person is [00:16:00] there, right?

That person is asking money and, and how do I get to the anxiety? My anxiety while focused on the other person seems like impossible. But it is possible when you think about what it is you are wanting from that person, what it is, how you want them to change, like what are you wanting or needing from that person.

So maybe it can be something like, uh, I, I want him to think I’m a. Nice guy, or I want him to like me, or I want, it could be anything. Uh, and here now I have a statement is I want him to like me. It is focused on the other person. So I am judging him, but it’s about me also, it’s about my wanting, what am I wanting from him?

And that, uh, can give you a little bit of the [00:17:00] best of both worlds. Um, so this is a key thing to look for if you’re looking for a way to look for those thoughts. Ask yourself, what am I wanting? What am I needing? Those kind of, that phrasing I want him to is a great way to catch those kinds of, of thoughts or, um, yeah, like anxiety is fear, right?

So I’m afraid of something. What am I afraid of? Well, I’m afraid of something. What? I, I don’t want him to do something or, uh. It might be if he does this, then I will, yeah, if he does this, if I do this, if I don’t give him money, he will not like me. Something like that. Like that could be an interesting one.

Um, so the key is. Let your [00:18:00] pay attention to your emotion and then see what thoughts are connected there. And don’t worry if it fits exactly the judge, your neighbor worksheet. Sometimes it will, sometimes it won’t. But you can trust your own emotion to, uh, give you ideas of what to work. And then you try one.

Maybe that’s not quite it. Like you start, it takes advantage of my weakness. Okay. And you find something and it’s, it’s okay. You might do the work on it. But it’s not a a hundred percent. Then you look again, okay, what is it? What is really bothering me? And then keep going like that. So, I don’t know. Those are a few thoughts.

What do you hear when you’re, when you’re thinking about this?

Client 3: Uh, he, um, I have to say that he can become violent because, you know, he’s addicted to.

Um,[00:19:00]

Todd: but so that could be, right There is a judge, your neighbor worksheet, right? I am afraid of him because he can become violent, and that is not, that’s not an anger statement, that’s a anxiety statement, I’m afraid so. Mm-hmm. Then what do I want from him? Line 2, 3, 4, 5, 6. You can just say, I want him too. Be more calm.

I don’t know what the, whatever the stressful thoughts are. Um, so anxiety fits beautifully on a judge your neighbor worksheet just as much as anger does. Sadness Also, also, so I

Client 3: can use, uh, sorry, sorry. Yeah,

Todd: I was just gonna say sadness also fits very well on judge your neighbor worksheet. A lot of emotions do, uh, not everyone works perfectly, but almost all do.

And in this case, uh, you can start with I am anxious with him because why? And then just fill in line one [00:20:00] and then just go straight down. That’s a straightforward way to go.

Client 3: Uh, so I, I, I have to put, I’m anxious or I have to put, I’m afraid of him. What is, yeah, what was the first thing you said?

Todd: Yeah, I’m anxious or I’m afraid, doesn’t matter.

Your words, whatever makes sense to you. Yeah. For me, anxiety and fear or basically the same thing. Maybe different degrees or different flavors, but it’s same idea. I’m worried about something that that could happen.

Client 3: So, uh, with this, the same system, I have to, to check, uh, what, what, um, what, uh, goes, uh, comes out from my mind.

I write a statement and then I get still and, uh, oh. Okay. There, there is a, um, can, can I say something further? There is a story that Byron told. Um, [00:21:00] it’s about a man with a gun that threatened her and it, I don’t know if you, you have ever read that, but mm-hmm. It’s very, it was very fascinating, the story of about, I remember that if you don’t have a few, you don’t have anxiety and, uh.

I, I, I’m very inspired from that, that story of Byron Katie. That’s very, it, it was very useful.

Todd: Yeah, it is. I remember that story. You know, someone puts a, a gun up to her and she, I don’t remember the details, but she basically didn’t have fear. She’s just open. Okay. And then in that relaxed state. She still dealt with the situation, but, um, she wasn’t believing her thoughts of, oh my God, I’m gonna die.

Oh my God, this is terrible. Oh my God. Oh my God. Oh my god. Yeah. That’s the anxiety, right? [00:22:00] So when you question those anxious thoughts, like, uh, he can become violent and all those things, uh, I want him whatever to, to be. What, I don’t know what the, your stressful thoughts are, but when you question any thoughts connected to the anxiety, my experience is anxiety becomes less, and then,

Client 3: um, is it, is it possible to reach the Katie State, Katie’s state of mind, that situation?

Todd: I don’t know. I know

Client 3: I’d like. Yeah,

Todd: I think we all would. Yes. Um, I, I don’t know. I only know my own experience, which is that it seems to approach in that direction seems to get more and more little by little, but I’m not there yet. Um, so, uh, I’ll tell you if I arrived there.

Yeah, I,

Client 3: I think that my situation is like the, the, [00:23:00] the rattlesnake stuff that you, you wrote on your website, that I think that in, in the end, this person, if I, if I say, Hey, I called the police. If you keep, keep treading me, he, he will stop. But I’m not, I’m not pretty sure of that. So I’m afraid because there is a possibility that he can become violent and hurt me.

Exactly.

Todd: Yeah. So the work deals with the, the fear. The fear is my thinking, making it even more scary than it is. Like it, it exaggerates the situation in my mind, and then I feel more and more fear. That’s what fear does, and that’s a good thing when you’re dealing with a rattlesnake or maybe a sometimes different violent situation.

But is it absolutely necessary? In the case of Byron Katie, we see, no, it’s not. Uh, in fact, when I’m less [00:24:00] anxious, I actually think clearer and I actually sometimes take, uh, more, uh, effective action as well. So yeah, doing the work can be amazing for just changing the experience under stress.

Client 3: Okay. Thank you very much.

Todd: You’re welcome. All right. Anyone else have anything you want to add to that or any other question or, yeah, Wendy.

Client 2: So I’ve been, um, trying to play with what you call the unusual turnaround a lot and. Is there, is there like a, like I looked at your sample and when it’s similar to your sample, I can find it, but is there like a process or, you know, like something that will show me how to use it better?

Because [00:25:00] it’s, it’s, it’s more like something I, I could have done or should have done, or should have seen or what, you know, what did I leave out that caused the problem.

Todd: Hmm.

Client 2: And that’s how I’m reading it.

Todd: Yeah. The, what I call unusual example, uh, unusual turnaround is not something that I find with every statement.

I would say it’s unusual, like it’s rare. Um, and it tends to be with certain actions that, uh, have a forwards and a backwards, right? That have a like. He is moving forward. You, you know, my example that always comes to mind is you’re sitting at a stoplight driving a car and suddenly you feel like you’re moving backwards.

Like, what is my foot on the brake? Hold on. ’cause you feel like you’re moving backwards, but in reality the car next to you is just moving forwards. So relatively speaking, [00:26:00] like relative to that car, I’m moving backwards and that’s what the mind thinks. But in reality, I’m staying. Standing and the car, other car is moving forwards.

So the, the, the relic, I don’t have a good example right off the tip of my head for that, for that unusual turnaround, but, um, it’s gonna be something like, like that. Let, let’s say, let’s say, let’s use the car example. So this original statement is, oh my God, I’m moving backwards, stressful thought, I’m moving backwards.

Uh, I better step on the brake, right? How do I react? I step on the brake. So. Um, so who would I be without the thought? I’m moving backwards. I would be less worried. I would be more open-minded. I would be checking out, is there something else going on? I’d be more calm. Turn around. Uh, I’m moving backwards.

I’m not moving backwards. That’s a normal turnaround, right? Um, [00:27:00] the unusual turnaround is he is moving forwards. It’s not a turnaround to the other. Exactly. It’s, it’s an unusual turnaround. He, I’ve turned around. He, I’ve, so I am moving backwards. I’ve turned around I to he, and I’ve turned around backwards to forwards.

I’ve changed two things in that sentence, which is usually going to create a spin, but it doesn’t create a spin because of this nature of the, the two cars. So I’m moving backwards. Okay. Makes it, makes it as like the turnaround is he’s moving forwards and it works as a turnaround, but that doesn’t always work with all sentences, doesn’t always make sense.

Client 2: So if the turnaround to the other or the turnaround to the opposite, if. If I look at that, then I would see whether or not it was an unusual turnaround.

Todd: That’s it. You, you had just explored [00:28:00] a

Client 2: step that a step misunderstood or a step misplaced or something that could have gotten

Todd: right. So I mean like the turnaround to the other would be ease moving backwards, but it doesn’t quite make sense, right?

Because that’s not, that’s not, mm-hmm. It doesn’t quite make sense in this situation. So it makes you think, is there an unusual turnaround here? Maybe something else. Let’s try, he is moving forward and. Breaking all the rules of only one, change one thing in a sentence to find the turnaround. Lo and behold, I changed two things and it worked.

And so that’s what I call the unusual turnaround.

Client 2: Yeah. So the, and the criteria would be, am I, am I in his business versus still mine? My perspective is my business and my, am I in his business or would be like, then that’s not gonna work. I.

Todd: Yeah, I, I think. I don’t get, would, should. Too worried about being in.

Yeah. I don’t worry too much about being in someone’s business when [00:29:00] I’m finding a turnaround because I’m already in their business. What I’m going, when I go back in to turn, turn something around is now I’m gonna go back into their business and turn it around and get, get it straightened out. You know what?

But what I’m looking for, you could almost call this turnaround the relative turnaround. Like there’s something relative to something else. Um, and. Um, right. Like he is, um,

I’m trying to think. Yeah. He is not listening to me. Okay. So the opposite of he is not listening to me would be, I’m not listening to me. Let’s turn around to the self. I’m not listening to him. I’ll turn around to the other. He is listening to me. Let’s turnaround to the opposite. But there’s another turnaround in there, and this is the unusual one, is I, I’m [00:30:00] not speaking well enough to him, so he may be trying to listen, but he can’t hear because I’m not speaking clearly.

And so this brings the responsibility back to me, which is what I think you were saying, like bringing it back to my, yeah, what’s my business? Um, but. It’s a fourth. It’s a fourth thing. It’s not the normal three turnarounds. It’s something unusual. Yeah.

Client 2: Well, I, I’m glad because there are times when I just can’t find it and that it’s good to know that it’s not always there.

Yeah. It, but I’m, I’m conscious of it, not turning it into, you know, fault on his part.

Todd: Yeah, I look for, for words that have an equal and opposite action, so you know, speaking and listening, they have equal and opposite action or going forward or going in reverse. Those are equal and opposite actions. That’s when I can start playing with this unusual turnaround.

If that equal opposite [00:31:00] action is not there, it doesn’t really make sense to try that turnaround.

Client 2: Okay, well thanks. Then. I don’t feel so bad that sometimes I can’t find it. Yeah, it might

Todd: be a large percentage of the time. I, I only come across it once in a blue moon

Client 2: when I have used it. It really helps me own my part in what happened and, yeah.

So yeah.

Todd: That’s the idea. Any turnaround that helps you own your part in things that helps you feel like it’s, you’re not a victim, then that’s gonna be a helpful turnaround. Anything else that doesn’t, um, then just leave it. Don’t have to go there. Like where we started with Marika, you don’t have to even the.

The original statement turned around to the opposite. If it doesn’t make sense, maybe the statement’s just true. Okay? Just because I question something doesn’t mean it’s not, not, doesn’t mean [00:32:00] that it’s automatically not true. Just because I question something doesn’t mean it’s not true. Could be true.

Great. All I wanna know is what is the truth? This is what doing science is about. This is what exploring is about. You test something and hopefully with an unbiased attitude, you’ll find out this is works. This doesn’t work. This makes sense, this, this. You find the laws of nature there and that’s, uh.

That’s all we’re doing in the work. We’re finding out what is true, what is not true. We’re not trying to force everything to be not true. That’s not it. We’re looking, that’s all.

If you would like to participate in open sessions like the one you just heard here, then go to the work as meditation.com and then go to the open sessions page. And there you can see the upcoming schedule. You can sign up and I’d love to have you be apart. There’s only seven seats in each session [00:33:00] session.

Um, but it keep, makes for a very. Intimate group, and it’s a great way to see others doing the work live, to ask your questions live or to participate in any discussions that come up. So also, while you’re at the work as meditation.com, I encourage you to look at the Finding the Door to Inquiry book. As I mentioned in the beginning of this podcast, this question about how to write a judge your neighbor worksheet on someone else, when it seems like the focus is on you is a common kind of question.

And I’ve written a whole book to help you understand and get ideas of how to go about this.

I’m going to read one of my newsletter articles called Is Nice How You Define a Good Person.

Daffodils are nice, but they’re also poisonous. I used to confuse nice and good. I grew up holding [00:34:00] nice as one of my high ideals. I. I’ve always considered myself to be nice. I’ve always tried to be nice and I’ve tended to respect people who are nice, and I’ve tended not to respect people who are not nice.

As you can see, nice tends to be a very central idea for me of what is good in life. It was this kind of golden standard for me to judge a person. Is he or she, nice or not? Heck, even Santa Claus uses that standard. It just made sense to me, but it didn’t stand the truth test. As much as I’d like to believe that being nice is the most important thing in the world, it just isn’t true for me anymore.

It comes from experiencing different people and looking beyond what was just the nice appearance. Some of the most genuinely good people I know are not. Nice. [00:35:00] They’re honest, they’re helpful, and serving bigger things than just my ego. And they don’t care if I don’t like them because they’re focused on what’s true for them.

I really respect that kind of honesty and that kind of, uh, in a way it’s, it’s interesting balance of taking care of themselves, but also a certain selflessness as well. They’re focused on other ideals besides just being valid as being a nice person. So as I’ve lived and as I’ve questioned, I’ve found that goodness comes in all kinds of exteriors, sometimes very gruff exteriors, and when I set my nice standard aside, I can see all that hidden goodness.

I invite you to question Nice as well. If you find yourself resisting someone because they’re not being nice in the way you think they should be, try questioning. I want him or her to be nice or [00:36:00] write a whole judge your neighbor worksheet on them and see what you find. What I love about the work of Byron Katie is that it gets you to scratch.

Below the surface to look for something more than just nice on the outside. Many people are able to do nice, but underneath they’re angry or frustrated. I’ve been there myself and, uh, when you question someone else you think is so not nice, and find that maybe they aren’t a little more nice than you thought, it can change your view.

I’ve discovered many other equally valuable traits in others besides being nice. It’s like there’s many things that count, and nice is just one of ’em. It’s not the whole thing now, but I had to look deep to find those hidden values because the ideal of being nice was blocking my view. I’ve also found that being nice generally still does work for me.

It’s my way. I like being nice. I. But it’s not an absolute, [00:37:00] and there’s no need to demand it from others or myself. In fact, there’s a lot of freedom and something that’s been growing in my life for years in being able to express myself honestly, even if it isn’t always what the other person wants to hear.

And I’ll end with a quote from Byron Katie in her book. I Need Your Love. Is that true? Politeness and tact are supposed to be about consideration for others, but notice how often they’re really about trying to control the impression you make.

So thanks for listening, and be sure to subscribe to this podcast. Share it with a friend, share it on social media. Leave a review for the podcast wherever you listen to podcasts, and stop by the work as meditation.com to get my newsletter or to participate in open sessions like the one you heard today.[00:38:00]

You’ll also find hundreds of articles on the work of Byron Katie, as well as information about the Work 1 0 1 course, the Work 1 0 2 Course, virtual Retreats. Uh. Inquiry Circle my community for doing the work, the Breakfast Club private sessions, living with Money course, finding the door to inquiry book, and other programs that I offer and continue to develop over time.

So thanks again for being with me. Until next time, have a great week.