Why Everyday Triggers Overwhelm the Highly Sensitive Person—and How Inner Work Can Help

Client: [00:00:00] Uh, we had both sort of come home at the same time. I was sort of in a rush to get a run in before this session and he was gonna go walk the dog and he was being, uh, considerate of me. But he had, the statement he made was, should I have some juice or lemonade? And. And I said, do what you want. 

Todd: Welcome to Wiggle Room, a podcast where we start with stress and then find ways of looking at the same stressful situation and seeing if there’s a way to see that in a less stressful way.

In other words, to turn the thinking around so that the experience is not so stressed. It’s so interesting to look at it this way because. Normally we spend our days trying to change things. That’s, that’s normal. We try to solve problems. We try to do things to improve our, uh, environment, [00:01:00] to improve our relationships, to improve so many things.

But, um, the work is like another dimension. Works in another dimension. I don’t have to, to. Change the outside things in order to experience, uh, more peace and freedom inside. Of course, I can still keep trying to change things, but I don’t need to, and that’s what we get into here in this podcast, which is dealing with a simple way of questioning what you think called the work of Byron Katie.

I’m Todd Smith, and on the program today, a participant does the work on the. I don’t want him to worry about pleasing me, and this was such a. Cool situation that she brought, just a small situation with her and her husband. Um, and he was doing something, asking her for some, whether she wanted to have the last of the juice or the last, last of the lemonade in the fridge.

’cause he [00:02:00] couldn’t have both. Um, but it was frustrating to her because she felt like he was trying to, uh, trying to please her and kind of in her business or something. And so. During this open session, um, we’re going to get a chance to hear how she works through the statement. I don’t want him to worry about pleasing me and what she finds as she goes through it.

So let’s get into the work of Byron Katie together here. And the, what we’ll be hearing is the recording of the open session for the last week, and it’s an unedited recording, um, which just. Allows you to experience how we do the work as friends, sitting, talking in a very informal environment.

Client: Um, I, I could come up with one, just happen just within the hour. Um, and, and by doing the [00:03:00] work, um, with your class taught, I realized that every situation and. That I react to has deeper roots and, and it seemed like a trivial, just back and forth between my husband and I, but I realized, ah, this is a worksheet.

Um, so, uh, we had both sort of come home at the same time. I was sort of in a rush to get a run in before this session. And he was gonna go walk the dog and he was being, uh, considerate of me, but he had, the statement he made was, should I have some juice or lemonade? And, and I said, do what you want. Um, and uh, I realized my reaction was.

Inconsiderate because it had deeper meaning for me. His question when, for him, his question was, I’m being considerate. There’s just a little bit juice and a little bit of [00:04:00] lemonade. Which would you prefer? I have. Um, so while I was running, I realized that for me, that question just triggered. Um, I want him to make his own decisions without worrying about trying to please me.

Um, yeah. And, uh, so that, that was, that was the situation, you know, should I have lemonade or juice? Um, that really triggered a reaction that I realized I. There was more to my reaction and he picked up on it. Um, right. But, um, luckily we, we were able to go out and sort it out, but, um, yeah, I I it could be a worksheet for sure.

Todd: I, yeah. What you’re finding there is that, that emotional interpretation, right? So he, the, the statement of fact, or what actually happened was he says. [00:05:00] Um, should I have juice or lemonade? Right? It’s, it’s like, just seems like nothing but what your mind was, was experiencing was based on the interpretation that you had, which is this some underlying thoughts there.

I want him to make his own decisions. I don’t want him to worry about pleasing me. Yes, those kind of thoughts are where we can go in and, and, and do the work. So. So, yeah, if you want to, um, we could do a little, little work on that. We 

Client: could, I mean, unless Bill has something that’s more pressing. ’cause um, I didn’t come prepared, so I don’t wanna step on anybody’s toes that’s prepared.

Client 2: No, no, no. Like, like this is, I’m astonished how beautiful this this story you just told is, I’m, I’m married. I’m married, um, to. The, the, the subtlety of what you just said, and yet its potential [00:06:00] to do derail things. I’m, I’m fascinated, so I would love to hear what, how you work through this. Okay, 

Todd: cool. Okay.

Client: Yeah, 

Todd: yeah. Okay. So, um, I wrote down two thoughts as you were speaking there and tell me, uh, if these resonate or if there’s one that, um, seems closer to it for you. Or if anything else comes up for you. So I heard, I wrote, uh, I want him to make his own decisions and I don’t want him to worry about pleasing me.

Does one of those sound like it’s not? Yeah. 

Client: The second one, I don’t want him to worry about pleasing me. 

Todd: Okay, great. So let’s do that. And the situation is really clear, right? It’s when he asks you, should I, should I have juice or lemonade? So in that moment, you don’t want him to worry about [00:07:00] pleasing you.

Is that true?

Client: Um, in that moment, no.

Todd: Okay. So how do you react? What happens inside of you when you think? I don’t want him to worry about pleasing you and here he is worrying about pleasing you. 

Client: Wait, let me go back. I don’t want him to worry about pleasing me. Can I change my answer to Yes. Sure. Okay. That landed better. Um, 

Todd: so is it true, don’t want him to worry about pleasing you?

Client: Yes. [00:08:00] 

Todd: Yeah. And can you absolutely know it’s true, you don’t want him to worry about pleasing you?

Client: Um, yes. Yes, I can. 

Todd: Mm-hmm.

Okay, good. So how do you react? What happens when you think, I don’t want him to worry about pleasing me and he is asking should I have some juice or lemonade?

Client: I get frustrated. Um, I go back to all the times he’s asked me. Should I do this or should I do that? Should I let the dog out now or should I leave the dog in? [00:09:00] Um, all the questions that seem logistical in a way and, um, just easy decisions for him to make on his own that I could easily adapt to. Um, but then I, I go deeper to.

Knowing that he has a fear that I may leave him, and that he is always looking for opportunities to show me his love and his loyalty and his concern, his, you know. That he’s here for me. He’s, um, and I say that fear that I will leave him because we’ve had a couple tough conversations about [00:10:00] my restlessness and we have an empty nest.

And I, I am, I. Feeling the focus back on me. Um, not so much as, as a, as a family and seeing some differences and thinking about the future and how I wanna live the rest of my life and being open about how I’m feeling, but I know it’s making him nervous inside. Um,

Todd: so when he says that, should I have some juice or some lemonade? How do you treat him in that moment when you think, I don’t want him to worry about pleasing me.

Client: I want him to make the decision. I want him to take all of the lemonade if that’s what he wants, and even if it’s what I want, I want him to make decisions that put himself above me before [00:11:00] me. To show me that he’s standing up for himself and not putting himself second behind me. Um, 

Todd: and when he doesn’t do that, how do you, what do you say?

What do you, what are the, what’s your body language? What do you think? How do you treat him? 

Client: Um, I am short. Um. I feel tense inside and, um, you know, close, I close up my heart, um, and

my battery cell. Um, and I feel unforgiving. Um.

And[00:12:00] 

I almost, you know, want him to,

I don’t know if hurt’s the right word, but just kind of, um, push me a little bit, you know, not, not be so kind. Um, 

Todd: right.

Yeah, 

Client: I’m gonna plug in my computer before I use my juice. 

Todd: Okay. Yeah, no problem.

So the thought I want him to worry about, I, I don’t want him to worry about pleasing me, um,

to notice, uh. Any other reactions when you’re thinking that thought in that moment? [00:13:00] I don’t want him to worry about pleasing me. Any images come up from the past or the future?

Client: Um, I.

I mean, it’s also a moment where, um, I, something that I need to work on that I, I get frustrated with his, um, lack of what I call good exercise. Um. And as I go out for a run and he goes out for a walk, I’m just reminded of he’s doing the thing that I, that I hope to be doing when I’m 90 and I’m doing the thing that I hope he would do too, or do something [00:14:00] that would, um, be a little more exertion and a little, um,

I guess I, I, I don’t consider walking the dog exercise. Um, and, and it was just a situation that repeats itself over and over again. And I, I’m having a hard time having a non-judging mind, um, when I get in those situations with him. So I, um, you know, that, that hits me, that, oh, here I am again. He’s walking the dog and, and I’m running and.

Here he is asking me. Yeah, so 

Todd: that’s how it, it starts, right? It’s like it’s, I don’t want him to worry about pleasing me, is going on, and then out of reaction to that I start looking for other things. It like it snowballs. Yes. It starts to become, now there’s [00:15:00] two issues that I’m frustrated with him about.

And if the mind can. If it keeps holding in that state, it can find three and four. It just keeps, it just keeps snowballing. So yeah, this is reaction. That’s what we’re looking at. Reaction. So who would you be without the thought that you don’t want him to worry about pleasing you in the moment when he asks you, should I have some juice or lemonade?

Client: I would recognize his kindness, his, um, consideration that I may come home after my run and like, oh, the lemonade. That’s what I’ve been thinking about coming home to and having the lemonade that he’s just being a really nice guy and I’m here, you know, criticizing him in my mind for not making a decision when.

He was making a [00:16:00] decision, uh, about what to drink, including me, so that it would be something that would please us both. He would get his thirst taken care of by either the juice of the lemonade. And I would, I’m a picky eater, picky drinker here. He has an opportunity to please me. Um, a small, a small moment of pleasure.

Um, I would.

Just, you know, open, accepting of him, um, not

looking for those areas where we have differences. Um,

and just. Be grateful, um, [00:17:00] that I have a partner in my life who’s kind and considerate. 

Todd: Hmm. 

Client: Um, and who frankly wants to please me. I, I, I should, I would be grateful for that. 

Todd: Yeah. The only thing that gets in the way of that gratitude, natural gratitude, is a thought like this. I don’t want him to worry about pleasing me.

As soon as that comes in, as we’ve seen, then the reactions come in and the separation happens. But without that thought, it’s just Wow. He is really thoughtful. 

Client: Mm-hmm. 

Todd: And the feeling is different. Mm-hmm.

So a thought, one thought makes a difference. That’s what we’re seeing. So how would you turn this thought around? I don’t want him to [00:18:00] worry about pleasing me.

Client: Um.

I do want him to worry about pleasing me. Um, 

Todd: okay. That’s the turnaround. Let’s see if it makes any sense. Is there any evidence to support that side of the story? 

Client: I do in the sense that I do wanna partner who is considerate of my feelings and my, just my, my being in his. Life and someone who shares food and drink with him.

Um,

I, I do appreciate, I, I do appreciate that he thinks [00:19:00] about me.

Todd: Yeah.

What are the advantages to you of him being that way, like worrying about pleasing you a little bit? 

Client: I trust him. I am comfortable. I’m not threatened. Um, I feel home at home with him. Um, I, I don’t worry. Um, about his loyalty or love for me. Um, when he does little things like that, he’s showing me that he loves me.

Um, and

I, I, I do appreciate that I’m, you know, it is, it’s, [00:20:00] it’s the little things right?

Here it was a little, a little thing, a little, uh, moment of his just showing his love and, and I turned it around to, you know, a fight. Right. Um, so yeah. Right.

Todd: Cool. So I do want him to worry about pleasing me. Is there, is there any, is there any other turnaround to the original statement? I don’t want him to worry about pleasing me. 

Client: Um, I, I, I mean, the other one I see is the complete opposite is I want me to worry about pleasing him.

Todd: Okay. It’s, it’s kind of double turnaround that one. It’s like, it would. It would be like, the original is I don’t want him to worry [00:21:00] about pleasing me. So if I turn it around just changing one thing at a time, then it would be, I don’t want me to worry about pleasing him. Okay.

And we can play with it, you know, sometimes even the, the double turnarounds can have some meaning in them. But let’s, let’s go with the. Kind of standard turnaround to the other here, which is, I, I don’t want me to worry about pleasing him. How could that be as true or truer than you don’t want him to worry about pleasing you?

Client: I guess I, I don’t want me to worry about pleasing him. I don’t want to use the word worry for either of us. Um, I don’t wanna put that stress in the relationship, um, which is what I’ve done. [00:22:00] Um, I want to please him. I want him to please me, but I don’t want either of us to worry that it’s not enough or it’s too much.

Todd: Yeah. Yeah. So of those two, which one can you control him? Him worrying about pleasing you or you worrying about pleasing him? Which one’s easier to control, we could say. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. So like the turnaround then has I. It’s closer to my domain. You know, I can’t even control myself a lot of the times, but, but it’s closer.

It’s a little bit, there’d be a little more chance of me, uh, not worrying about pleasing him, um, than trying to change him, which may be I, I, I can’t, I don’t have [00:23:00] that control. So these turnarounds, they always bring me back to. What can I do? What can I do? And this is one of them. I can not worry about pleasing him.

And, and you know, another place is you may find that you do worry about pleasing him sometimes. I don’t know. But if you do, then you can start to see the equality. Like, oh, sometimes he worries about pleasing me, but I also do that to him sometimes too. So do you have any examples in that, uh, area? 

Client: Um, sadly, not so much on my behalf.

I, I, I don’t find myself worrying or wondering if I’m pleasing him. I am sort of in a negative mindset right now, and I’m, um. Which is focused [00:24:00] on him and not me, which this is what the work’s about. Mm-hmm. For me is really trying to explore what I bring to a relationship, um, and, and how I’m projecting, um, my own self criticism and.

Darkness and all my own stuff onto him because he’s my, he’s my person. I live with him. I know him. Um, he’s really the mirror that I see myself in. Um, so I guess in that way, if I’m not worried about pleasing him. What does that say about me? Not worried about pleasing my own self.

Todd: Hmm. Yeah. Yeah. That’s a whole other turnaround. But before we go [00:25:00] into that, there’s something, it’s something interesting about what you were just saying. Like I, I. I may not be doing exactly what he’s doing to me. Like I’m not worrying about pleasing him so much, but I’m doing something different, some other kind of a negative thing with him.

And so that may be be my version of how I’m not treating him ideally. And so let me work on that, maybe do that less and then. If again, I can control that better than whether he worries about me, um, or not. So sometimes it’s not an exact match. Right. But there’s something I’m doing to him that probably he doesn’t like, just like he’s doing something to me that I don’t like and so I could at least play with dropping what I’m doing to him.

Client: Yeah. Yeah. Possibly. Yeah. I see that very much. Yeah. 

Todd: Cool. [00:26:00] Again, it brings us back to equals. He’s doing it something to me. I’m doing something to him and it’s okay. We’re humans and we’re working on it. So, so that other turnaround that you just mentioned, I don’t want me to worry, worry about pleasing me.

Where does that go? Does that make any sense? Um. Sometimes these turnarounds don’t make any sense, right? You just play with them and if you find something great, if not, no problem, but play with it a little bit. I don’t want me to worry about pleasing me. Does that make any sense? In the moment when he’s saying, should I have some juice or some lemonade?

I.

Client: It does a little bit. I mean, I, I, um,[00:27:00] 

it, it, it sort of makes me wonder, am I not accepting or receiving his kindness? Because I don’t feel like I deserve it. Is it this? Why are you being so nice to me? ’cause in my head, I’m being so mean to you and I don’t deserve this. Um, um, I should be unkind to my own self too because I’m, I’m beating up, you know, my partner of almost 26 years.

And, um, is, it seems unfair. Um.

When I know that I, I need to work on myself, I can’t help but pick at him sometimes and turn things around in a negative [00:28:00] way,

Todd: and then when he’s kind, you can’t receive it because you’re feeling like you’re not being kind to him. So. It’s not fair or something. Yeah. Interesting. So what you’re doing to yourself and to him in, in your mind or in your, in your behavior, um, closes down your ability to receive his actual, possibly genuine.

Client: Yeah. I realize I didn’t even really see it as being kind. I saw it as, here you are throwing it in my face again, that you want me to make a decision for you because you’re too worried. I’m unhappy and that the choice of juice is gonna make you happy. So you decide, you decide, which, you know, really makes a lot of sense because, um, you know, I’m the one that went to therapy.

He’s the one that didn’t wanna go to [00:29:00] couples therapy. I do have this feeling that I’m the one that has to do the work to make this relationship work. So I guess it was the trigger of, here it is again. Focus is on me. I make the decision about the juice because I am the one doing the work for our relationship.

Yep, 

Todd: yep, yep. It’s a story that gets generated and reaffirmed and suddenly I’m the one carrying all the weight and I’m a victim of your, your lack of ability to evolve. Yes. That’s it. And this juice is just an, just an yes. Another expression of it. So it’s like, that’s how the mind works. It, it creates a story.

It creates a, it, it’s the ultimate, uh, spin doctor, right? It can create a story and, and then. Withhold anything [00:30:00] that doesn’t support the story and beef up all the, the evidence that supports it. And pretty soon I’m just, I’m just fully believing it. So it’s nice to deconstruct it a little bit in this process of inquiry and just see, oh wait, it may not be what I’m thinking it is.

Client: Yeah. 

Todd: Yep.

So. 

Client: Oh, thank you. Thank you, Susan. Yeah, it’s, you know, when will the story end? I guess the story Never, it’s just a constant story. We’re always working on it, you know, it changes shape a little bit, but it’s,

Todd: well, the nice thing about doing the work is that, that that story gets balanced. Like it’s, you know, like. Balanced reporting in a newspaper tells both sides. So when we do [00:31:00] the work, we start telling ourselves both sides. We start educating ourselves to the real story. And, and with that, some, some balance comes in.

And, and when that balance does come in, there’s uh. Like the story becomes less sticky, right? Less emotional. It’s becomes like, oh, okay, this is the fact, these are the facts and this is what we can try to work with. But it’s not the, the fight that comes in when I’m so sure that I’m in the right, he’s in the wrong, or he needs to change whatever.

Right. So yes, the stories do keep going, but in my experience, they become less sticky. Yeah. Over time like that, I don’t know if I’ll ever get rid of all the stories, but I, yes. I’m less caught in them. Yeah, 

Client: that’s, yeah. I see that. Yeah. Yeah.

Todd: If you would like to participate in open sessions, like the recording we [00:32:00] just heard, then go to the work as meditation.com and then uh, click on the open sessions page and you’ll see the schedule of the upcoming sessions and you can actually participate and do the work with me, ask your questions about the work.

And it’s a great way to. Engage with this work and become more familiar with it.

Next, I’m gonna read one of my newsletter articles, and this one is called, when Doing the Work, does it matter Whose business you’re in? This is an interesting article. It’s uh, it’s a topic that comes up with people who have been doing the work for a while and some people, um, almost are afraid to. To, um, look at certain turnarounds, look at certain aspects of what they’re exploring.

’cause they’re afraid of being in the other person’s business. So let me read the newsletter. [00:33:00] When doing the work, does it matter whose business you’re in?

Good fences Make good neighbors. Says the fa famous poet, um, Robert Frost. Staying on my side of the fence is good. Byron Katie often invites us to ask ourselves, whose business are you in? I love this question. Whose business are you in? It often shows me where I’m in someone else’s business. It’s almost always stressful to be in someone else’s business because I can’t actually control what other people do.

So when I ask myself, whose business am I in? I see I’m in someone else’s business. It starts to bring me back to, oh wait, I, I would be more comfortable here, uh, in my own business. Just noticing that, that I’m in someone else’s business can be very helpful in bringing me back to my own business. But [00:34:00] it’s easy to take this principle of not being in the other person’s business too far, especially when doing the work.

So the work. Is a way to come back home, right? I’m, I’m stressed because I’m out in someone else’s business. That’s really what causes the stress. So by definition, when I’m doing the work, I’m moving from being in someone else’s business, which is stressful to being in my own business, which is peaceful.

That’s the whole process of what the work is about. Sometimes you have to go back into the other person’s business when you’re actually doing the work in order to get out of their business and come back into your own. It’s kind of strange, but, um, here’s an analogy that can help. Let’s say I hopped the fence, um, crossed over into my neighbors.

Uh, territory and let’s say that I, that not only did I [00:35:00] trespass while I was there, but I actually built a little fort on the other person’s land. You know, this is just an analogy. In order to come fully back to my business, it’s not enough for me to just come back to my side of the fence. To really be free, I need to go back across the fence to his side and take down my fort, dismantle it, take all the lumber away and like leave it in the same, um, state that it was before I literally have to trespass again in order to completely remove the effect of my previous trespassing.

So the same is true when doing the work. Let’s say I’m judging somebody, uh, for judging me. A stressful thought that I’m working is he thinks I’m a failure. And when I think that thought, I’m literally trespassing over into his business. But by doing the work on this thought, my intention is to come back into my own [00:36:00] business.

The turnarounds are always what point me back. So turnaround to the self would be. I think I’m a failure turnaround to the other. I think he’s a failure. These are things that I’m doing. So this is in my my world, turnaround to the opposite. He doesn’t think I’m a failure. All of these turnarounds are an invitation for me to come back to my business, but I might end up resisting the turnaround.

He doesn’t think I’m a failure. Sounds like, oh, wait a minute. That’s in his business. How do I know what he’s thinking? Right? He doesn’t think I’m a failure. Could be, um, I could be back over on the other side on, on in his, in his business, and I might say, oh, I can’t know that. That’s his business. And what I do in doing that is I discredit the turnaround before even considering it.

And in doing so, I would miss a piece of freedom. The problem is that I left my fort still intact [00:37:00] on the other side of the fence. What was the fort that I left on his side? The fort is my belief that he thinks I’m a failure. I constructed that fort when I was over there in his business in the first place before I ever did the work.

I built this whole story of how he thinks I’m a failure. He thinks I’m a failure. He really thinks that I have all kinds of proof. I have a big story there if, but if I, in doing the work, if I don’t cross back over into his business and dismantle this fork, this story. That I’ve created, then it will just keep on standing there for a very long time, and a piece of me will always remain in that trespassing position.

Basically, I’m thinking for him, believing that he, that he, uh, uh, that he thought I was a failure all this time when it may not even be true. So dismantling the fort means going back into his business. Coming up with [00:38:00] alternative ideas of how he may actually not have been thinking that I was a failure, and this is so important.

I may not have any concrete evidence of this. I may not know anything about how he actually thinks. I may not know a lot about his mind at all, but even circumstantial evidence, even just possibilities, are enough to help me start dismantling my idea that he thinks I’m a failure. I. I may be simply left with, I don’t know, and, and that’s enough.

The fort has been dismantled. Even if I just come to the place where, you know, I’m just not so sure anymore that he thinks I’m a failure. You know, I don’t have proof that he doesn’t think I’m a failure, but I don’t have proof that he does think I’m a failure either. And so I’m left in a very neutral place.

Notice in all of this. I’ve never talked to him. I’ve never asked him. I’ve never gotten. Anything from him at all? I’m just [00:39:00] going back in looking at the story that I created of him and finding the possibilities that the opposite could be true and that balances it out. So my turnaround examples neutralize my original stressful belief.

I was in his business when I originally thought. He thinks I’m a failure and I’m in his business. When I find examples for the turnaround, he doesn’t think I’m a failure. In both cases, I’ve crossed the fence, but now these two equally possible ideas neutralize each other and because these two opposites, he thinks I’m a failure and he doesn’t think I’m a failure, have kind of have kind of neutralized each other.

I’ve. Literally taking care of that story, or I’ve reduced that story and I’m free to return with an open heart to my side of the fence. So this second crossing back into the person’s business was actually [00:40:00] necessary in order for me to dismantle what I had previously constructed. Sometimes it literally takes a thorn to remove a thorn, or in this case, it takes going into someone’s business to get myself out of somebody’s business.

So here’s a quote from Byron Katie. My love is my business. Your love is yours. You tell the story that I’m this or I’m that, and you fall in love with your story. What do I have to do with it? I’m here for your projection. I don’t have a choice in that. I am your story. No more, no less. You’ve never met me.

No one has ever met anyone, and that’s from Myron Katie’s book, A Mind At Home With Itself.

So [00:41:00] these, uh, newsletter articles can be found on the work as meditation.com. I write a new one usually every week, and, and it’s a great way to, for me to. Sit in some idea connected to the work and kind of explore and learn, and I enjoy doing it. I sometimes almost forget that I send it out to other people, but it’s, it’s something that I really enjoy and I hope you would also enjoy it, uh, as well.

So. When you’re, uh, exploring the newsletter, I also encourage you to go to the work as meditation.com and explore open sessions like we heard today, and look at all of the different articles that are available there, as well as the courses that I offer. The most important course that I offer is called the Work 1 0 1.

This is a nine week course or a nine month [00:42:00] course. There’s a slow version of the course where you can get into depth about what the work of Byron Katie is and more importantly, to get into the actual practice of it. We do a lot of work in that course, and you learn by doing. So check that out. Um, also feel free to check out my virtual retreats and, uh, my ongoing practice group, inquiry Circle, and other programs that I offer.

Well, thank you for joining me today. It’s a pleasure to share this work with you. I’ve been doing it for a very long time and I am still excited about this simple way of. Exploring a stressful thought and finding that there are other ways to see it that I had not even thought of before. So next, until next time, have a great [00:43:00] week.